Leon In Denver Wrote:
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> dolphaholic. Marshall was not involved in that
> shooting. I don't know where you are getting that
> from. He was there, that's all. Never an issue in
> Denver.
> Not saying I want him for many other reasons,
> although he can sure play. And for most of last
> year he was very good in the locker room.


Don't bring facts into the debate

Leon In Denver Wrote:
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> dolphaholic. Marshall was not involved in that
> shooting. I don't know where you are getting that
> from. He was there, that's all. Never an issue in
> Denver.
> Not saying I want him for many other reasons,
> although he can sure play. And for most of last
> year he was very good in the locker room.

Can someone show me where I said he was. Now Mike lets talk about bringing facts into a debate.

MikeO Wrote:
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> dolphaholic Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I'll move on.....but I want the last word
> We
> > can win with this group, we have. And who says
> we
> > dont have anyone that can turn into a top line
> > reciever? Hartline alone has better 1st year
> > numbers (and his speed is right there too) then
> > some of the all time greats. I'm done.
>
>
> Now Brian Hartline is an all time great. That is
> downright SILLY and FOOLISH!

Did I say Hartline is an all time great? NO, stop trying to spin my words to make you look smarter Mike. T.H.E.R.E I.S N.O R.E.A.S.O.N T.O T.H.I.N.K T.H.A.T H.A.R.T.L.I.N.E C.A.N.T B.L.O.S.S.O.M I.N.T.O A T.O.P T.E.N R.E.C.I.E.V.E.R A.S H.I.S. F.I.R.S.T Y.E.A.R #S A.R.E I.N L.I.N.E W.I.T.H S.O.M.E O.F T.H.E A.L.L T.I.M.E G.R.E.A.T.S Slower for you?

insinuating that because Hartline had an average first year he "could" turn into an all time great still isn't a good comparison. But if that is something you want to believe, more power to ya.

You are insinuating it. I strongly disagree!!!

"he "could" turn into an all time great"
Where in the HELL do I say that Mike? God you like to twist words around.

"You are insinuating it. I strongly disagree!!!"

Fair enough, I have no problem with this statement.

Leon In Denver Wrote:
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> dolphaholic. Marshall was not involved in that
> shooting. I don't know where you are getting that
> from. He was there, that's all. Never an issue in
> Denver.
> Not saying I want him for many other reasons,
> although he can sure play. And for most of last
> year he was very good in the locker room.


Marshall says himself that he goes to bed each night knowing that he was the real target of the shooting. Marshall was the catalyst for the incident. And then there was also the time that Marshall and his father got into a fight over money, and Marshall pulled a gun and shot at him.

It's downright silly and foolish to say that you know Hartline won't be an all time great. are you a prophet now? lol

No. If Florio knew more about the Dolphins, he'd know our holes are on Defense. We ranked 25 last year on D. That's bad. Even considering we faced teams like the Colts, Saints, Pats...

Our offense ranked 15. That's better then average.


By these basic numbers our choice is clear. Defense is the issue, and we've already taken steps to correct it with DC Nolan and ILB Dansby. I forsee we further strentghen our D and pick a Defensive guy with number 12.

Hartline will never be an all time great. He doesn't have the skill set to be one. (ie Size and Speed)

He can be a good player and he probably will be a good player. But his ceiling is set at a level that isn't an all time great level.

Wes Welker doesn't have the size and speed to be an all time great either.

Odenn Wrote:
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> Wes Welker doesn't have the size and speed to be
> an all time great either.


Exactly. I agree

Although when it's all said and done, he'll be considered one of the greatest receivers the Pats have ever had(statistically).

In Pats history he will go down as a great. That's fine.

In the history of the NFL he will never be considered an All Time Great though. Either will Hartline. Those guys just don't have the skill set to ever be on that level. Doesn't mean they are bad players or can't have long, solid, succesful NFL careers!!

I suppose Largent wasn't an all time great either?

Largent was an all time great. But his skill set is/was much higher than Hartline's. Largent had a ton of physical tools.

Just because they are both white doesn't mean they are the same player

Largent was 5'-11" 187#s with average speed.

Now Brian Hartline is the next Steve Largent.....WOW!

Largent is one of the 5 best WR's to ever play the game, and we have that in Hartline......oooooooooooooooooooooook!

You're straw manning it Mike.

What's being said isn't that Hartline is going to be the next Steve Largent. What's being said is that just because a player doesn't have what some football experts would consider elite skill sets, doesn't mean that player can't succeed to a level that would put them in the upper levels of the NFL.

You guys sat here for a year and said Hartline is slow. Now your trying to say he could one day be an elite NFL WR??

You can't have it both ways. Your talking out of both sides of your mouth.

I actualy think Hartline is pretty fast. Faster than anyone on here since you all ripped me last year when I did say hew as fast (those posts are archived on here, go look). And I am higher on Hartline than most here, but he will never be an elite NFL WR on the same level or class as Steve Largent. That is laughable.

Largent had maybe the softest hands in NFL history. He dropped nothing. He ran crisp routes to perfection. The man was a ball catching machine. Hartline's hands aren't that good, he will never run routes like Largent (nobody has since has retired)....the comparison is laughable

You know how you can tell when you got Mike.....he starts trying to twist your posts around. Thanks Odenn, thats all I was trying to say.

not twisting anythnig.

Your all of the place in this deabte and keep changing it. So let me be crystal clear on my stance and well the facts..


Hartline can be a good NFL WR, but never an elite one. PERIOD! Largent was an elite NFL WR! The comparison is poor.

I think we should have faith in the Trifecta's first RD picks. Jake Long, Vontae Davis and really Philip Merlin since he was pick 32 that year, all appear to be good picks at critical positions. Whoever they draft in RD 1, I am sure will be as good as, if not better then the above mentioned players. Now after the first round, there alot of unproven picks. Last year alone Pat White and Patrick Turner, but the first Rd the TRI has done pretty well IMO. So that being said, I do not think we should give up our first rd pick to anybody for anything. That pick has been critical to the rebuilding of good young players at critical spots by the Tri. Have Faith.
ps- Florio is defintely a dolphins hater, so I am not sure taking advice from him would be a good practice. IMO Zach's bid held alot more weight, but still disagree. All that being said I would give them 2 second rd picks for Marshall. This years and nexts, that is unless we plan on drafting Dez or Golden.

No one really knows if he will turn in to an all time great, but that doesn't mean he won't. That is your opinion. Only time and games will tell. For us I hope he does.

Who cares what Mike Florio thinks.

Rick

There is a major difference..those other guys (with the exception of Incognito..I don't know enough about him yet) have made mistakes..Dez Bryant is just a kid who has made mistakes.. but Brandon Marshall is a proven BAD GUY!

Rick

NOT "reality". Just your twisted perception of it. We may not have a true "no. 1", but we have GOOD 2nd, 3rd, and 4th options and good depth. And Brandon Marshall is NOT the guy I would want to add to that mix. He's a BAD PERSON.

Rick



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/28/2010 07:43PM by dolphan4545.

Jerry Rice didn't have the size and speed to be an all-time great either. He had only a fair first year, too.

Rick

Now Briant Hartline is the next Jerry Rice. Steve Largent wasn't enough

Rice was 6'2" ...Hartline is 5'10"

Coming out of college, Rice was the MVP of the Blue Gray game. He was first team AP his senior year in college. Had much better resume, better size, and more physical ability with a higher ceiling. He held the College recieving record from 1984-2006! Not to mention in his ROOKIE year he had an 11 catch 260 yard game or something (can't remember the exact numbers but in that ballpark).

He was also NFC ROOKIE OF THE YEAR ......so saying he had a "fair first year"...just not true!

Look you guys need to come back to reality. And putting Hartline in the same sentence and mentioning him in the same breath as guys like Largent and Rice isnt' fair to Hartline. And is only setting youself up for dissapointment about 7 months from now when Hartline isn't anywhere near and won't be showing a skill set anywhere near those types of players.


We all love Hartline. But lets not even mention him along with Rice and Largent. He's not in that conversation. He shouldn't be included in any groups with those type of players. He's not that type of player and never will be

dolphan4545 Wrote:
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> NOT "reality". Just your twisted perception of it.
> We may not have a true "no. 1", but we have GOOD
> 2nd, 3rd, and 4th options and good depth. And
> Brandon Marshall is NOT the guy I would want to
> add to that mix. He's a BAD PERSON.


Quick question, not being a wise-ass either. You said we have a GOOD 2nd. Who is that?? To me Bess, Camarillo, and Hartline are all that #3 type slot WR's. I don't see who has shown you they have the ability to be a GOOD #2 WR in the NFL?

The ONLY one on our roster with that potential is Ginn. Because of his speed and if he can just hold onto the ball, he is a legit #2 with his physical ability to create a big play and speed to blow past people. None of the other 3 have that ability in my opinion.

So is Ginn the "GOOD 2nd" your talking about?