dolphaholic Wrote:
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> Can I ask all of the owner lovers 1 question. Why
> didn't the owners just let the current CBA run
> it's course until 2013? (it's only 2 more years)
> Why did they have to opt out and grandstand? I'll
> tell you why, they the thought the players would
> crumble under fear of a work stoppage and agree to
> a bad deal, what other reason did they have to opt
> out early?


Anyone?

Crowder52 Wrote:
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> Honestly, I hope you are right phinsfans, and Mr
> Ross and the rest of the ownership groups are
> making money hand over fist, and this is all one
> being sham by the owners. I just dont believe it
> to be the case, if it was so , I dont believe the
> owners would have jeopardized the golden goose,
> over a chirade.

RESPONSE: If you were a kid in the 50's, you knew about the game of "Chicken." Two guys in two cars would start off on a straight road miles apart and drive toward each other. If you swerved your car first to avoid the head-long collision, you were the "chicken."

Of course, if neither did it, it was "James Dean time."

"Chicken" is played as a matter of course in ALL labor negotiations. The "Golden Goose" in labor negotiations always is tied to the chopping block with both sides swinging around the big axe.

Just like in "Chicken," crashes rarely happened, in labor negotiations, strikes and shutdowns are the exception not the rule.

The point of this is that as long as there is a second to spare, neither side will "chicken" out.

Here, the court process throws a random element into the equation.

But, berkeley223 can correct me if I'm wrong, those who say that the Court will find the "decertification" process to be a sham are wrong because that process is a valid step and has been upheld time and time again.

I don't think that setting aside the decertification is even on the legal table. But then again, I'm a criminal law prosecutor and not a civil attorney, let alone a specialist in labor law.

The court fight will be about opening the books, not decertification.

Back to the question of how it will end, it won't end until the last possible moment wherein the season would truly be threatened. At that point, a halfway point will be reached or the most unreasonable side (who by the way is the side that is trying to advance its position over and above the last contract) will give in because they will reason (like business people, labor or management do) that it is better not to kill the goose that is laying the golden eggs even if your object is to create two golden-egg laying geese.

ChyrenB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Crowder52 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------

>
> But, berkeley223 can correct me if I'm wrong,
> those who say that the Court will find the
> "decertification" process to be a sham are wrong
> because that process is a valid step and has been
> upheld time and time again.
>
>

I'm not really sure what the legal standard is for whether a decertification is legit, but I read the NFL's brief and it seems to me like they have a pretty good argument. Essentially the last time they decertified they represented to the court that this was truly it, they will never be a union again, and the court upheld the move as a true decertification. They reformed as a union a few years later. The NFL's brief points out lots of comments by players and union leadership before during and after the decertfication announcement that this is just a temporary move to give them increased collective bargaining leverage. Whatever the standard of "sham" is, this does sound kind of bogus and the fact that it was upheld before doesn't necessarily mean it will fly this time. Not sure what the implications are if it is not upheld. I thought the NFL's brief was pretty convincing, at least to someone who is not a labor lawyer....

Thanks for weighing in, berk. I'd like to glance at the NFL Brief. Where can I find it?

lol, yeah you are right eveyrone wants debt, since it is so easy to borrow money right now...lol. Business with profits are getting crushed becasue of the inability for large loans to be renewed. If interest rates and the cost of money goes up these guys are screwed, and yes that is tied to inflation. Are you lost? Cap rates are low which means you have a greater value for your assetts, as cap rates get higher then means less value for your cash flow. Anyone in and around debt, is trying to do absolutlely anything and everything, to get rid of that debt or restructure. You sit around and hold onto large commercial debt and tell me how you fair over the next ten years.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/03/2011 01:38PM by Crowder52.

berkeley223 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm not really sure what the legal standard is for
> whether a decertification is legit, but I read the
> NFL's brief and it seems to me like they have a
> pretty good argument. Essentially the last time
> they decertified they represented to the court
> that this was truly it, they will never be a union
> again, and the court upheld the move as a true
> decertification. They reformed as a union a few
> years later. The NFL's brief points out lots of
> comments by players and union leadership before
> during and after the decertfication announcement
> that this is just a temporary move to give them
> increased collective bargaining leverage. Whatever
> the standard of "sham" is, this does sound kind of
> bogus and the fact that it was upheld before
> doesn't necessarily mean it will fly this time.
> Not sure what the implications are if it is not
> upheld. I thought the NFL's brief was pretty
> convincing, at least to someone who is not a labor
> lawyer....


What do you mean Berk, Ghoti has us convinced the owners already lost and this whole things is already over.

April 6th my friends........April 6th.

I have not been following lately that well what's so special about April 6th?

Thanks, berk.

So two more days until the hearing but a decision is not expected for a couple weeks possibly. Maybe even after the draft.

You would think that ownership is chomping at the bit to get rolling in free agency and start filling the roster holes. You know the coaches and front office people are!

Problem is that ownership is more worried about $ and cents and are willing to go to the last minute to ensure a better long term deal. One thing they don't want is to have a shortened season because that means loss of revenue.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

according to some on this board big day coming tomorrow in this ongoing labor dispute.

The owners are ready to roll the players are acting like spoiled children. I told everyone that the owners would come out looking better, and now the players are acting like sore losers.