Parcells thinks he's the NFL Godfather for cries sakes.

The mans over-inflated fat arse EGO is like 3 times the size of Jersey.

Who cares? I dont.

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"

I think the team should sue him for breach of contract. Ross doesn't have the stones, however.

Aqua&Orange Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Who cares? I dont.


i care, because apparently, we could have gotten all the help he gave us by simply asking him, instead of paying him for it. doesn't seem like the contract did much to stop him from helping anyone else anyways.

"It's been fun to get the reaction of visiting coaches to the color of their locker room. Most don't notice it, but those that do are in trouble. . . . When I talk to an opposing coach before a game and he mentions the pink walls, I know I've got him. I can't recall a coach who has stirred up a fuss about the color and then beat us.” Hayden Fry

I posted it under the worst reporter subject
It doesnt matter... it is the past, and serves no purpose..

But I will say this, these guys are all friends, they talk to each other... THe Jets are just bringing it back up, to stick in the knife of the phins and its fans. end of story...

But I will try and put in it perspective for you, When you are in a fantasy league with your friends, sometimes you ask their advice on moves you might make on the waivers, or recommend a player you dont need to a friend... It has happend to me every year for the last 12 years I have been playing.. Tannenbaum is tight with Parcells, he asked him what he thought about Ryan, and Parcells said he liked him and he was in the running for the phins job, I think he is a good guy and good coach.. WTF, big deal..... Dont let the press and the Jets PR machine stick it to us with this type of crap. the week the Jets are in the Championship game... All of the coaches and GM's talk to each other and recommend players to each other behind closed doors...

ps- SParano has beaten Ryan 3 out of 4 times. We got the better coach...

g_fish55 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Aqua&Orange Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Who cares? I dont.
>
>
> i care, because apparently, we could have gotten
> all the help he gave us by simply asking him,
> instead of paying him for it. doesn't seem like
> the contract did much to stop him from helping
> anyone else anyways.

You know, I care about this too. I don't know what his contract requires, but while under the Phins employ he helped a team with advise that is our competition. That doesn't seem right at all.

Kick him in the ass and out the door

as a legal matter, when you are employed by a company, you have a duty of loyalty (even if not spelled out in the contract) which requires you to at all times act in the best intetest of the company, which would include not doing anything that would help a competitor. Helping the jets while employed by the dolphins would be contrary to that and a breach of contract.

berkeley223 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> as a legal matter, when you are employed by a
> company, you have a duty of loyalty (even if not
> spelled out in the contract) which requires you to
> at all times act in the best intetest of the
> company, which would include not doing anything
> that would help a competitor. Helping the jets
> while employed by the dolphins would be contrary
> to that and a breach of contract.


then every coach , GM and team scout throughout the NFL are in violation and breach of contract...

really? every coach, gm, and team scout help other teams while under contract to their current team? news to me

if thats the case what has bill Belichick, or Mike tennenbaum ever done for us?

"It's been fun to get the reaction of visiting coaches to the color of their locker room. Most don't notice it, but those that do are in trouble. . . . When I talk to an opposing coach before a game and he mentions the pink walls, I know I've got him. I can't recall a coach who has stirred up a fuss about the color and then beat us.” Hayden Fry

berkeley223 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> really? every coach, gm, and team scout help other
> teams while under contract to their current team?
> news to me


yes, I guess it is news to you

Crowder52 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> berkeley223 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > really? every coach, gm, and team scout help
> other
> > teams while under contract to their current
> team?
> > news to me
>
>
> yes, I guess it is news to you


RESPONSE: Crowder, you have to present me with specific other examples where this has happened. I don't think there are any. This seems as egregious a violation of a fiduciary duty as I have ever seen. Parcells should have said "Hey, I'm employed by the Dolphins. I couldn't say anything if the team were the Chicago Bears in another conference, let alone a team in my own division."

I've never seen some a concrete example of a PRESENT EMPLOYEE making recommendations for the upgrade of a competitor establishment. Perhaps Crowder, you are thinking of old coaches no longer employed such as Jimmy Johnson, etc. who lend their advice to former owners.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/21/2011 03:55PM by ChyrenB.

crowder, don't take things so personally. anyway in none of your examples is there anything like giving specific advice to your #1 competitor on who to hire or advice to the coach of that competitor on how to be a better coach. that's crossing the line

Arent't you being a bit ridiculous about it..lol. I said all Gm's and Coaches would be in breach of contract. You said that is news to me. And I presented examples of coaches and gm's admitting it "your said breach of contract" A coach or Gm sharing information with each other while under contract with another team.. It is not big secret

I am not taking it personally. But when someone says I dont think what you are telling me is truthfull, that is kind of calling out my credibilty about the things I post.
I feel if you are going to suggest that what someone is saying is not being truthful or confused, it is natural for the person being questioned to state the facts and the fact that he is being truthful. I honestly thought 99 percent of people understood these facts about the NFL, because coaches and Gm's mention it in interviews like Pioli did from time to time...
Chyren asked for examples, so I gave some examples as he asked for, now you tell me it is not enough...Come on..
If you choose to believe it doesnt happen. that is up to you, all I can do is give you some facts that support why I believe otherwise...

I think the problem is to many lousy reporters like to report things like this and feed off the PR plan of another organization or their own. If they were really reporters they would have done some investigating on their own before going half cocked on a story piling on our organization and kicking Parcells. Because they want someone to kick and blame... SO now a bunch of people that saw the reports and now are regurgitating every word as truth. That is why the press can be so dangerous. I dont blame any of you for not knowing, it is really due to lousy reporting of information based on a bias or agenda or just laziness...

No, you didn't give any concrete examples of personnel from one team having a conversation with employees OF ANOTHER TEAM AFTER BEING ASKED TO GIVE THEM ADVICE ON MAKING THAT COMPETITOR BETTER.

You vaguely replied that coaches have conversations with friends and that information may get back to other teams.

You said that coaches make comments to news media (such as Ryan saying that Belicheck was the best coach in the NFL). That hardly fits the example.

Nobody is saying you are lying, just that you are wrong.

And BTW, berk and I are lawyers so you are the one taking us on in our own field. So who is challenging whose credibility.

I repeat, as an employee in a competitive situation, you have a duty not to aid a competing company in a material way such as offering your opinion that a coach would be good or to stay away from another coach that would be bad.

You cannot compare that to praise offered to the media or gossip to your friends and relatives.

This was a direct call asking for help on a management decision and if it goes on all the time like you say, it is still wrong even if the offended team does not punish for it. The fact that everybody jaywalks at that light does not make it legal to do so.

And the buddy-buddy relationship referred to in bold in your post before the last one seems to cover situations that both could and could not arguably fall within the violations berk and I pointed out. But since no specifics were provided of just what advice was sought and rendered, we can't say.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/22/2011 08:58AM by ChyrenB.

Like I said. Parcells wants to be the Godfather of the NFL.

Huge egomaniacs like him and his pal Bobby Knight are so over-inflated with their coaching genius and cliché bag of “wisdom” they can’t help but make an ass of themselves. It is, after all, a sure fire way to get the attention they crave.

crowder, any time someone disagrees with you they are calling you a liar? this is an internet message board and people disagree all of the time, nothing to get all up in arms about.

Of course not Berkeley, But when someone says
"Crowder, you have to present me with specific other examples where this has happened. I don't think there are any." That suggest I am either confused or making up what I am saying, no?

WHich was a response to this initial statement, I was responding to that you questioned, Berk

"really? every coach, gm, and team scout help other teams while under contract to their current team? news to me" and I said "yes it is new to you..."

Did my examples not answer this question... You guys want to get more specific and are unsatisfied with my respones.
Now you guys want me to come up with an exact example of a private conversations, that is identical to the one that happend..

If you guys are really lawyers you sure need to sharpen your skills... I deal with lawyers and contracts daily but I am not one. Am I qualified enough to have an open discussion with you guys... HAHAH, that was a sense of humor... I know alot about lawyers enough to know I always hire 2 at a time, one for the deal and the other one to keep the intial guy honest...lol Cheers... We are allowed to disagree
Sorry my information was unsatisfactory to you guys..
May i suggest to you both that you prove to me that it has never happened, cause I dont buy that it has never happened...
You want to put me in the position of defending my point of view , how about you guys bring evidence to the contrary...
SO far I think the evidence i provided will be stronger then any evidence you both will provide to the contrary..

Well, Crowders, it would be a strange executive contract that did not have any clause in it prohibiting working in the interest of a competing company and therefore against the interest of your own company but anything is possible, I guess and no, I haven't read the contract (they are not a matter of public record, you know).

I didn't say you discussed the Ryan-Belichick comment. That was just an example of the type of thing I thought you were referring to.

And those comments that you quote about "we advise each other" are far too general, non-specific and vague as to reveal the precise nature of this advice. However, the lead-off advice by Parcells crossed the line, even in the minds of the Sports reporters, obviously, they made the same point as berk and I.

That is one of the most disgusting things I have ever seen.

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"

Chyren, I understand your point and perspective, I just dont agree with it. The truth probably lies somewhere in the middle of both the arguments IMO..
Since you guys are lawyers I would like to ask this, if you had a client that was signing a multiyear multi million dollard deal, and your client expressed that part of the business was using past relationships with other GMS and coaches you trust as sounding boards at times and adivsers when make big decisions in your job. Wouldnt you as the lawyer for your client advise him to address this in his contract as to not put him in void of his contract through expected business practices...
I also find the word "Sounding board" kind of interesting, almost all of the examples I found the same word, "Sounding board" was used to describe the action. My guess is that "sounding board" has a meaning in the contract of these guys, and they are allowed to use people outside the organization and maybe be used outside the organization as a reciprocal "sounding board" from time to time.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/23/2011 05:36AM by Crowder52.

The difference here is between an employment reference and a breach of fiduciary duty....to bring it into a clearer light:

Situation 1: Bill Parcells gets a call from the Bills about Chad Henne who has just been released, Bill says that he thinks Chad was handcuffed by Henning and that he is a better quarterback than people saw on the field.

Situation 2: Bill Parcells gets a call from the Bills about Chad Henne who is still with the Dolphins, Parcells says the same thing and adds, he will be released on March 24th, thus saving the Bills from trading for him.

Situation 1, No wrongdoing whatsoever

Situation 2, fire the lawyers up, Parcells is going to be cutting a big check

The difference is when you offer a compeititor a CLEAR advantage that is to the detriment of your present employer.

Crowder52 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ChyrenB Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > No, you didn't give any concrete examples of
> > personnel from one team having a conversation
> with
> > employees OF ANOTHER TEAM AFTER BEING ASKED TO
> > GIVE THEM ADVICE ON MAKING THAT COMPETITOR
> > BETTER.
> >
> > You vaguely replied that coaches have
> > conversations with friends and that information
> > may get back to other teams.
> Pioli said. You know Thomas Dimitroff..... we
> advise each other.....He also said in ref to
> Belichik and Parcells and his relationship with
> them "They are good advisers" "The important
> relationships in this business transcend what you
> do on the field."
> What does that say if a GM says that?
> >
> > You said that coaches make comments to news
> media
> > (such as Ryan saying that Belicheck was the
> best
> > coach in the NFL). That hardly fits the
> example.
> > Where did i say this?
> >
> Nobody is saying you are lying, just that you are
> > wrong.
> >
> > And BTW, berk and I are lawyers so you are the
> one
> > taking us on in our own field. So who is
> > challenging whose credibility.
> >
> > I repeat, as an employee in a competitive
> > situation, you have a duty not to aid a
> competing
> > company in a material way such as offering your
> > opinion that a coach would be good or to stay
> away
> > from another coach that would be bad.
> >
> Have you seen the contracts, how do you know this
> issue isnt dealt with in the contract..
>
> > You cannot compare that to praise offered to
> the
> > media or gossip to your friends and relatives.
> >
> > This was a direct call asking for help on a
> > management decision and if it goes on all the
> time
> > like you say, it is still wrong even if the
> > offended team does not punish for it. The fact
> > that everybody jaywalks at that light does not
> > make it legal to do so.
> again you are assuming you know all of the inter
> workings and precise details of NFL executives
> contracts.
> >
> > And the buddy-buddy relationship referred to in
> > bold in your post before the last one seems to
> > cover situations that both could and could not
> > arguably fall within the violations berk and I
> > pointed out. But since no specifics were
> provided
> > of just what advice was sought and rendered, we
> > can't say.
> I said in my first post that private
> conversations of this type are rarely reported on.
> But I feel what Pioli said all but proves the
> point.


it would be a strange contract indeed that said it was OK to aid your competitor. Even without a contract saying you can't do it, employees owe their employers a duty of loyalty not to aid a competitor. that's just the law, not a matter of opinion or really debate.