dolphaholic Wrote:
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> "All I know is we could have had Earl Thomas AND
> Sergio Kindle with our first two picks"
>
> I kinda think and being in CAPS says otherwise

RESPONSE: I said what he meant. I didn't speak to what he said.

Phinfans2:

I'm not saying we only field one linebacker on a play in football. I'm saying that in terms of drafting and needs, linebacker, Inside or outside is only one need consideration.

The old saw is that "you lay down with dogs and you come up with fleas."

It is my fault for arguing with someone as simple-minded as MikeO that gives everyone the impression that I am saying that we only play one linebacker at a time.

But even if you have a loss of 3 of your linebackers, you don't fill the need entirely from the draft. There are trades, free agent pickups, and undrafted free agent pickups.

If you have a chance to get a Jahvid Best or a Toby Gerhardt (and I know most of you disagree that running back should be drafted at all) or get a Cody that can stuff up the inside run all on his own, I say you go for it.

Torrell Troup is in Buffalo and Terrence Cody is in Baltimore.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

Phinsfan2 Wrote:
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But its not. It's two different considerations
> ILB and OLB that require very different skill
> sets.

RESPONSE: And just like Defensive Tackle, NT, and DE/OLB (Eric Kumerow, Jason Taylor)

There are "tweeners" and persons who can fulfill both. Odrick himself fits that category.

Just like at receivers, there are number 1s and number 2s and guys who can fit either with both sets of sizes and skills.

>
>
> It's like saying O-line is one consideration when
> it's 3 different considerations.
>
RESPONSE: No, it isn't. On O-line you have center, guard, tackle and Tight end. There can be some mixing of two but no one would say that about O-line.


> Bob, please knock off the insults. You two can
> disagree without being disagreable.

RESPONSE: The reality is that because MikeO kept pounding that theme in over and over, you accepted it and the fact that I had to correct you is proof.

Therefore saying that when you lie down with dogs... or (I could have said) "Don't argue with an idiot because people looking on can't tell which is which," is not an insult but a consideration specifically directed at the discussion at hand.

Now...as far as insults not connected to issues is concerned...if you just look at MikeO posts....

> Wouldn't have minded any of those guys but the
> only one staring at Buffalo in september is
> possibly Cody.

RESPONSE: They said Dan Marino would never be expected to start over David Woodley.

The truth is that ntil the pre and post season starts, no one knows.

There are many factors that are considered by teams during the NFL Draft. As fans, we see the immediate needs and think we know best. We listened to media hype up the top 12 players, and then we wanted one of those players. But the future needs to be considered. We have been told that Miami is being built for the long haul. That means we may have a few years of not being one of the superbowl favorites. After promises of the last few coaches, I'd like to build a team that will be competetive for years.

Before I voice my displeasure with this draft, I will wait to see how these players develop. Not all players drafted are starters. Out of a 53 man team, more than half are backups/special teams players. Every team has injuries, but the teams with the best backups are able to recover when faced with injuries. In case you didn't notice, we tend to draft players that are able to play more than one position, making it easier to cover for injuries, and also gives them a chance to contribute if they fail at a position by trying them at another.

Let's not forget that since other teams also drafted players that they wanted, they will have to cut veterans to make room for their draft pics. I believe the next wave of free agency will have some great players, and we may find one or two that will improve us. Cheer up, all is not lost. Many of you wanted to fire the Trifecta because we didn't do enough in free agency, then after the Brandon Marshall trade most of you backed off. Just one move made a difference. Well, I'm sure there will be future moves to make you happy. We still can trade for players and future draft picks too! Woohoo!!!

Wow. Gotta side with MikeO here. Going into the draft the linebacker corps was in complete crisis. The fins D is heavily dependent on linebacker play. These is an excellent chance that 3/4 of those LB picks will all contribute, both as starters and in rotation.

Saying the strategy here was to take 5 or 6 players in hopes of finding 1 starter is completely misrepresenting the situation.

Phinsfan2 Wrote:
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> MikeO Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Because nobody starts 4 WR's. Plus NO team has
> > only 1 or ZERO quality WR's on their roster
> come
> > draft time, so the need to draft 4 is just
> insane!
> > It's never done!!!
> >
>
>
>
> Mike, for what its worth...Houston started 4 WR's
> with warren moon and the fun'n'gun offense.
>
>
> Yeah in 1987!!!! Thats my point!

I also agree with MikeO. If you draft 1 player at a position of need and he fails, you have problems. If you draft 2, you effectively double your chances of success. I'm also one to agree that there are different types of linebackers, hence our doubling up on inside, and on outside linebackers (some pics may be able to play both). So since 4 linebackers were drafted, it is safe to assume that the Miami staff felt that linebacker was the biggest need for the team. If we find even just one good starter and one good backup from the linebackers in this draft, that part of the draft should be considered a success.

ChyrenB Wrote:
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> MikeO, there are trades and there is free agency
> both pro and undrafted. You don't have to get it
> all from the draft.
>

What the $93 mill we spent on Brandon Marshall and Karlos Dansby don't count? Go tell Sephen Ross that since its his money!

You cant argue with people that dont understand football. We had a great draft! Get behind the team and front office, these BS claims by people who say we had an awful draft are laughable. Sitting from their homes with no jobs in football, scouting, nothing and they claim Sparano, Parcells and Ireland are fools.lol.... I am just curious do you guys really believe your own BS.

Crowder52 Wrote:
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> You cant argue with people that dont understand
> football. We had a great draft! Get behind the
> team and front office, these BS claims by people
> who say we had an awful draft are laughable.
> Sitting from their homes with no jobs in football,
> scouting, nothing and they claim Sparano, Parcells
> and Ireland are fools.lol.... I am just curious do
> you guys really believe your own BS.

Yeah, Crowder. You will be one of the first ones bitching and moaning when we are unable to put any points on the board next season.

I bet at that point, according to you, It'll all be Henne's fault.....even if Ricky and Ronnie are gone through injury.

The professional evaluators should by no means be immune to criticism. I thought at the time that taking Pat White was ill-advised.

But having said that, its hard to find too much fault with Parcells and Ireland so far this offseason. At the very least, they seem to have done a reasonable job.

Off-season yeah but this draft seems like the same blindness that had them draft Pat White.

I disagree. There really were no Pat White-esque headscratchers this weekend. Even in the late rounds, they got some very nice value. I think Jones is going to turn out to be a steal.

You make a good point with respect to R&R. I would be loath to rely on either alone for a full season. But together, its hard to consider that position a weakness. I also consider the fins success on the ground to largely be a function of the O-Line. Lex freaking Hillard had a fine ypc average. Theres really only so much contingency a team can plan for in the offseason.

Next year, I think the fins get a RB through the draft - and keep in mind this is the one position where you can plug in a rookie immediately and he will produce. Its not as if they have to develop a player for several years.

It would have been nice to get a RB in the first few rounds, I agree that we are thin at the position, as we are relying entirely on players who are either old and flaky (RW), coming off injury (RB, Cobbs), just OK (Hilliard), and unproven but probably nothing special (Kory Sheets). But not in the first or 2d round because we had positions where we had NO ONE (L, the issue was not depth like RB. Once we got into the 3d, I'd have been Ok taking RB over the Guard, but it didn't seem to me like there was anyone worth taking.

so my question, who in the 3d round should we have taken at RB? If no one there who was great, I'm OK beefing up the OL (though I think I still would rather have had a safety, WR, or TE).

Sconigli wrote:

I disagree. There really were no Pat White-esque headscratchers this weekend. Even in the late rounds, they got some very nice value. I think Jones is going to turn out to be a steal.

RESPONSE: Actually, I have no problem with any of the picks as players themselves. No, there is no Pat White player.

But what I am saying is the idiocy of picking an undersized non professional sized player like Pat White manifested itself in this draft in a DIFFERENT WAY IN THE FORM OF the juvenile decision to so panic at linebacker that we devote half our draft to it.

That's a different criticism.

But did they really "panic"? Misi looks like a beast and by all accounts was a great pick at #40. Edds sounds like a fine player. To me, neither of these picks had the "feel" that they were desperately reaching to fill a need. I could be wrong, but that is at least how I see it. And then they took some dude late in the 7th round who sounds more like a special teamer.

Who else you gonna find in Rd 7, your starting Left Tackle. Seriously in Rd 7 if you find a special teams monster that is a good pick!!

I made a draft spreadsheet many years back that I cant seem to find now. Basically I found that it is significantly harder to find a premier DE in the later rounds than it is to find a stud RB. Although I would have been happy with a blue chip skill position pick in round 1, I can't balk at the fins for taking Odrick.

Interestingly, LT was the position where you were least likely to find even a starter, let alone a probowl caliber player, after round 3 or so.

Am I reading this correctly? Someone is saying that LB is one position, and not in reality 3(Inside, Weak outside, Strong outside)?

Odenn Wrote:
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> Am I reading this correctly? Someone is saying
> that LB is one position, and not in reality
> 3(Inside, Weak outside, Strong outside)?


YEP!! Funny Stuff huh! lol

While I'm going to get drawn into the personal insults and such that prevail on these boards these days, I will try to explain why Bob's wrong here.

The linebacker position in our 3-4 scheme is basically divided into 3 different areas, each area requiring a certain particular skill set to play effectively.
-Inside LB- Must stop the run, be excellent at shedding head on and crack blocks, with a decent talent for drop zone coverage. Blitzing isn't especially a necessity here.
-Weak Outside LB- Must be the blitzing prodigy. Playing the run, while a plus isn't a requirement in most situations. This guy needs speed and speed, and more speed.
-Strong Outside LB- Must set the edge against the run strongly, while having a talent to rush the QB while being doubled.

Each of these positions requires a DIFFERENT type of player. I hope you understand now why with the team in the state it was before the draft that we took the number of LB's we did. We didn't really have a choice.