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          Getting #1
Miami Dolphins Civilized Discussion :  Phins.com Phorums The fastest message board... ever.
This is a moderated phorum for the CIVILIZED discussion of the Miami Dolphins. In this phorum, there are rules and moderators to make sure you abide by the rules. The moderators for this phorum are JC and Colonel
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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: ChyrenB ()
Date: March 07, 2020 07:35PM

We can fulfill our top need, which is a QB, at number 5.

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Re: Getting #1
Date: March 08, 2020 05:57AM

samsam3738 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So by tcpf illogic lets not pick a qb at all. Who
> needs one.lol. oh boy.


Where did I say that sam? I thought we were talking about the 83 draft.

Take 5 minutes. If you can show me where I said that Sam , your wish is my command.

I've only said , and history is on my side, you dont have to pick a QB in the Top ten to get a great one , or to win a Superbowl.

This draft is different from the past. We have several picks and OPTIONS. Our Team is rebuilding from the ground up. So many holes to fill.

Our Team needs to be really smart about this. The winning option is not always the obvious choice. But then again.....maybe it is. Unique draft. WE HAVE OPTIONS.

GO MIAMI!!!

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: jlyell13 ()
Date: March 08, 2020 08:53AM

I think TCPF is just saying the top QB's dont always win. The best teams win. We could never get Marino a running game and Skins ran all over us in the bowl. Brady, Russell wilson are evidence QB aren't always found in the top 10 nor first round. Marino was what the 7th QB taken that year? Lamar Jackson and Aaron Rodgers passed on by many, including the Phins. I knew Rodgers would come back to haunt us. He shredded a top SC D that year

Love? Hurts? Fromm? Gordon? Eason?

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: ChyrenB ()
Date: March 08, 2020 11:43AM

The fact that you can cite exceptions proves the rule.

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Re: Getting #1
Date: March 08, 2020 12:40PM

jlyell13 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think TCPF is just saying the top QB's dont
> always win. The best teams win. We could never get
> Marino a running game and Skins ran all over us in
> the bowl. Brady, Russell wilson are evidence QB
> aren't always found in the top 10 nor first round.
> Marino was what the 7th QB taken that year? Lamar
> Jackson and Aaron Rodgers passed on by many,
> including the Phins. I knew Rodgers would come
> back to haunt us. He shredded a top SC D that
> year
>
> Love? Hurts? Fromm? Gordon? Eason?


Exactly. Russell Wilson also comes to mind. Hes got a ring , Luck is out of the game. Build those trenches or it doesn't matter who the QB is.

GO MIAMI!!!

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: dolphan4545 ()
Date: March 08, 2020 01:03PM

Leroy Keyes drafted by Philadelphia.

Rick

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: ChyrenB ()
Date: March 08, 2020 02:55PM

Probably the only NFL player I personally knew. I didn't know Greise although he sent me a personal letter after I sent him one after a rough period in his pro career.

But Leroy Keyes knew me as we both marched to desegregate Lafayette, Indiana schools in 1967.

I also remember him holding me and laughing after I ran the campaign for Paul Chenea (a hippie) and Linda Mitchell (a Black Woman) who ran for Purdue student body President and Vice President on an independent ticket. We only got a pitiful few votes. Leroy Keyes grabbed me and held me and laughed at how few votes we got. He kept saying "this is the Independent ticket, huh? Independent!"

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Re: Getting #1
Date: March 08, 2020 02:58PM

SIGH.

GO MIAMI!!!

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: ChyrenB ()
Date: March 10, 2020 10:34AM

Who's trolling who?

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: jlyell13 ()
Date: March 19, 2020 04:10AM

With the FA frenzy we could be making a big offer for Joe

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: Ken ()
Date: March 19, 2020 09:17AM

Well I hate to condone this, but with all of our free agent signings and factoring all of the turnover in QB’s around the league. I think we are going to have to trade up if we want a top QB this year.

If we are going to do it we need to “try” to go to #1 and get Burrows. I wish I could be a fly on the wall in a few meetings the Phins will soon be having.

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: astro34 ()
Date: March 19, 2020 11:43AM

Ken i disagree, If Cincinnati takes Burrow only San Diego and New England need a QB upgrade. Which means someone will be there at 5 for us. I still want Simmons at 5. If the draft goes the way it could he may be there and we still could get Herbert or Love at 18.

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Re: Getting #1
Date: March 19, 2020 06:44PM

I have no doubt a QB " will be there" at 5.The trick is getting the right one. Not another Darnold or Rosen. IMO Burrows is the best Prospect since Luck. If we have any chance on getting him we should consider it.Otherwise hold off trade down and take a shot on Hubert, Love or even TUA if they feel they must. I dont. But what I think and $10,00 will get you a cheeseburger at Shulas in the stadium.

Burrows is as close to a definite bonafide HOF as there is. Kid is phenomenal.

GO MIAMI!!!

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: Ken ()
Date: March 20, 2020 10:59AM

I’m not sure that any of the top three guys will be there at five. Burrows and Tua both will most likely be gone with a possibility of Herbert being gone as well.

Herbert will not be there at 18.

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Re: Getting #1
Date: March 20, 2020 12:08PM

Ken Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I’m not sure that any of the top three guys will
> be there at five. Burrows and Tua both will most
> likely be gone with a possibility of Herbert being
> gone as well.
>
> Herbert will not be there at 18.


The trick is "Top guys". Remember Ryan Leaf? Robert Griffith III? Todd Black Ledge, Jamarcus Russell,Tim Couch , Rick Mirer? I could go on and on.

Burrows , TUA, Hubert. The odds of all 3 going on to be special is very very low. My Money is on Burrows. Thats almost a sure thing. Hubert looks damn good but has issues with accuracy. Very much like Tannehill....Hes a shotgunner who likes to run. TUA is damaged goods.

If we have any chance to get Burrows we consider it. After that.....I'm just not convinced until the lower rounds.#18 etc. Picking ANY QB at # 5 just to have one is silly IMO.

GO MIAMI!!!

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: jlyell13 ()
Date: March 21, 2020 10:01AM

TCPF posted


The trick is "Top guys". Remember Ryan Leaf? Robert Griffith III? Todd Black Ledge, Jamarcus Russell,Tim Couch , Rick Mirer? I could go on and on.

Burrows , TUA, Hubert. The odds of all 3 going on to be special is very very low. My Money is on Burrows. Thats almost a sure thing. Hubert looks damn good but has issues with accuracy. Very much like Tannehill....Hes a shotgunner who likes to run. TUA is damaged goods.

If we have any chance to get Burrows we consider it. After that.....I'm just not convinced until the lower rounds.#18 etc. Picking ANY QB at # 5 just to have one is silly IMO.


Would agree. With FA acquisitions Burrow making a big offer for is likley. Tua too risky and I dont think anyones moves to 3 or 4 for Tua or Herbert, also Love as high an upside

Burrow
Young - Skins wont let him drop to Giants
Okudah Makes sense with Slay gone, but they could take Simmons or move it
Wills

If we cant get Burrow, take Herbert , but still like dropping to 12 & 18 with Raiders Love may be there and we take the following first & second

Jordan Love
Josh Jones
Deandre Swift
Cesar Ruiz
Jeremy Chinn
KJ Hamler

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Re: Getting #1
Date: March 21, 2020 12:34PM

jlyell13 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> If we cant get Burrow, take Herbert , but still
> like dropping to 12 & 18 with Raiders Love may be
> there and we take the following first & second
>
> Jordan Love
> Josh Jones
> Deandre Swift
> Cesar Ruiz
> Jeremy Chinn
> KJ Hamler


Thats a Plan! thumbs up

GO MIAMI!!!

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: Ken ()
Date: March 21, 2020 01:20PM

Miami needs a QB, we all know that. Let’s assume for a second.

Cin takes Burrows...
Wash then takes Young. But they ‘could’ take another QB since the the current coach has no ties to Haskins. If they do, Tua or Herbert is gone.
Lions most likely trade out of 3. If they do the last of the top three is gone
Then there is the Giants, who also ‘could’ trade, if they do the last QB is off of the board.

It’s not beyond possibility that we miss out on them all. In this case, Love and or Hurts does not make it to 18 or 26.

Just saying, it’s risky to stand pat, and if we trade down we lose out on all three anyway.

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: ChyrenB ()
Date: March 21, 2020 01:39PM

I agree, Ken.

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Re: Getting #1
Date: March 21, 2020 06:08PM

Ken Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Miami needs a QB, we all know that. Let’s assume
> for a second.
>
> Cin takes Burrows...
> Wash then takes Young. But they ‘could’ take
> another QB since the the current coach has no ties
> to Haskins. If they do, Tua or Herbert is gone.
> Lions most likely trade out of 3. If they do the
> last of the top three is gone
> Then there is the Giants, who also ‘could’
> trade, if they do the last QB is off of the
> board.
>
> It’s not beyond possibility that we miss out on
> them all. In this case, Love and or Hurts does not
> make it to 18 or 26.
>
> Just saying, it’s risky to stand pat, and if we
> trade down we lose out on all three anyway.

What are we losing out on Ken? Burrows is the only QB Practically ready to start.The others have plenty of cons to go with the Pros. No need to assume. We need a long term answer at QB. But its NOT our most glaring need and we have options this season. Just picking a QB for the sake of it has its historic consequences.

Again.....taking a QB at 5 is not wrong.I get that train of thought if they feel a starter is there at 5.
But picking a "project"or someone who can't contribute right away with a top 5 pick is just extreme Undervalue.Its not smart and Miami needs to be smarter if we are going to be successful.

GO MIAMI!!!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/21/2020 06:09PM by TreasurecoastPhinsfan.

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: ChyrenB ()
Date: March 21, 2020 08:07PM

Unless you get a rare talent at another position, you take QB if you don't have one (and I don't mean a bench rider). I remember sitting in the stands at the Coliseum one year in the second half of the 1960s. I don't know who was playing USC. But it was the first time I saw OJ play live. Most of us have seen dogs run in an open field. They make slant moves at full speed none of us could make.

I saw OJ make those moves that I had only seen dogs make. As far as matching that level of talent, I hadn't or haven't since seen any football player who could do it, not Marino, not Griese, let alone not any other running backs.

Now we don't have a quarterback. Franchise QBs are chosen high in the first round. Brady was the exception.

You just can't expect to pick em up in the later rounds. Moreover, the great chances are that you won't get them in the 20's of the first round.

We have a pick in the top 5 of the first round. We should grab, if we can, Burrows, Fromm, or Herbert, if we can and if our management knows something about Tua's injury that brush aside their own concerns about his health, then Tua. (Not saying I have such information but they are in a position to know more than the average NFL fan.)

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Re: Getting #1
Date: March 21, 2020 10:04PM


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Re: Getting #1
Date: March 21, 2020 10:04PM

TreasurecoastPhinsfan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Franchise QBs are chosen high in the first round.
> Brady was the exception.
>
>
>
>
> I'll start with 3 of the best QB's in the History
> of the NFL:
>
>
> Dan Marino was almost a second rounder.
>
> Brett Favre, 2nd Round, 1991
>
> Joe Montana end of the third round ,
> practically a 4th rounder
>
> Drew Brees, 2nd Round, 2001
>
> Roger Staubach, 10th Round, 1964
>
> Lamar Jackson was #32 almost a second rounder
>
> Russell Wilson 3rd Round
>
> Matt Hasselbeck, 6th Round, 1998
>
> Rich Gannon, 4th Round, 1987
>
> Aaron Rodgers 24th overall
>
> Joe Flacco 18th overall
>
> Kurt Warner UNDRAFTED eye rolling smiley
>
>
> BRADY was hardly the exception. In fact Top 5 QBs
> are rarely that successful. Ask Andrew Luck how it
> all worked out for him.

GO MIAMI!!!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/21/2020 10:06PM by TreasurecoastPhinsfan.

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Re: Getting #1
Date: March 21, 2020 10:11PM

Oh and to add insult to injury.......Your most hated QB in the NFL Ryan Tannehill was a Top Ten QB.

Long history here of people saying how bad a QB he is. So.....If Franchise QBs are chosen high in the first round........Why was he traded? Yet Late rounders like Marino, Montana, Staubach, and Breeze etc. Did so well? eye rolling smiley

GO MIAMI!!!

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: ChyrenB ()
Date: March 22, 2020 10:47AM

You have a quilt patch way of looking at things.

Last first, Tannehill was traded by us because he stunk here. I'm not going to go back to my million time explanation why he stunk here, something that Tennessee cured and made him good.

I remember the Brees Rivers draft. I kept hoping for Brees because he came from Purdue. If I remember correctly, Rivers was the last pick (or QB pick) of the 1st round and New Orleans drafted Brees with the first pick in the 2nd round.

Staubach???? 1964?????

You're missing the point. The point is NOT that great QBs can ONLY come from the top of the first round but that they USUALLY DO.

Now if you are a team that is "set at" the QB position, it makes little sense for you to use a top 5 draft choice on QB.

BUT...if you are a team like the Dolphins that DOESN'T HAVE your FUTURE QB, then it makes little sense for you to pass on the touted QBs of that class, PARTICULARLY if you have a first round top 5 pick errr...pass on a highly touted QB to errrr… LIKE YOU TREASURE ARE SUGGESTING....errr...to choose a lineman.

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: ChyrenB ()
Date: March 22, 2020 11:41AM

Okay, I'll break it down as simply as I can.

You're looking for a car (let's assume you cannot buy a new car). I know it's the draft and all the cars are new cars but bear with me.

Two guys are in your neighborhood selling their used cars. One car has a solid engine, it needs work on the carb, radiator, head and brake lights, radio, etc.

The SECOND CAR has all of those accessories working fine but it's engine is ""in-need-of-replacement" shape.

Every one of your knowledgeable friends would tell you to take the car with the good engine.

If you can't see the point, I don't know how you reached adulthood, Treasure.

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Re: Getting #1
Date: March 22, 2020 11:49AM

If your a Team like Miami you need to score on your first pick. After Burrows and TUA the QBs talent pool falls dramatically. TUA is damaged goods.That leaves Burrows or a project.

If you have GATZ , that's Italian for nothing you take a shot at 5 with a QB.

We dont have Gatz. In fact I'd be very interested to see a motivated Fitspatrick behind an improved Oline. Same with Rosen.

So why undervalue our #5 just because?
Unless our staff knows something we dont about TUA, or another QB. Why do you all feel so desperate about a QB every friggin season when our entire team is so bad? The defense is shameful. Worse then 1988 bad.The oline, the running game ......awful. Our QB played well last season under tough circumstances.

Maybe we pick one , maybe we dont. It's not the end of the world either way.

I'll tell you what. No matter who we get. Even Burrows.....we dont improve this Team, the same people will be calling for his head like you did Tannehill. And now hes the franchise QB in Tennessee.

Build the Trenches.....the franchise QB will come.

GO MIAMI!!!

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: ChyrenB ()
Date: March 22, 2020 12:14PM

Let my prior post be considered a response to your last post.

Readers can go back and read it after reading yours.

But "gatz" is Italian for nothing??????????????

No, niente is Italian for nothing.

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Re: Getting #1
Posted by: samsam3738 ()
Date: March 22, 2020 01:02PM

I agree with chren.

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Re: Getting #1
Date: March 22, 2020 06:45PM

Hey. I gave a ton of reasons for a different perspective......I always have always will.

You never answer, never give point counter point.just ....you want what you want. But....I appreciate no insults this time. However your lack of any response speaks volumes.

GO MIAMI!!!

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