THE Truth Wrote:

> If Watt and Suh were both free agents and you
> could sign one which do you want?

RE: Given the fact that the Phins already have Wake, Vernon and Jordan on the roster...I take Suh.

If we didn't already have two very good DE's on the roster and one waiting in the wings, then I go with Watt. In our situation, Suh is the logical choice between the two.

3-4 DE = 4-3 DT

Watt could play anywhere on the line...besides our DE's are either getting old or inconsistent.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/05/2015 06:03AM by JoeFootball.

Why are we even talking about watt...?

He wasn't released.

Watt is 6'5", 285 and while I agree that he has the talent to play anywhere on the line he'd have to put on 20-30 pounds and would loose a bit of quickness in the process. At that point it'd be difficult to say if he'd be better than Suh.

Anyway, it's a great thing to talk about but ultimately it's a moot point...

Because you always stay on topic?

Ken Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Watt is 6'5", 285 and while I agree that he has
> the talent to play anywhere on the line he'd have
> to put on 20-30 pounds and would loose a bit of
> quickness in the process. At that point it'd be
> difficult to say if he'd be better than Suh.
>
> Anyway, it's a great thing to talk about but
> ultimately it's a moot point...

He was measured at 6'5 290 at the combine. I'm sure he has put on some NFL muscle and is closer to 305. Even if he didn't...

Earl Mitchell is 290 lbs....Aaron Donald is 285 lbs. Suh is 307.

Watt would have to do nothing but line up and play. No way should he bulk up to 320 lbs.

I dont think anyone is daydreaming about Watt Sam, he got brought into the convo because he's currently the highest paid Def player in the game and Suh is looking to match or beat his numbers (I assume), then there's the comparison of if he should be paid more than Watt or not.

JoeFootball Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So let me get this straight.....
>
> You post this silly crap....
>
> Who wants to be like that mustle guy?
>
> They say people who use steroids have their
> private parts looking like a really small pencil.
>
> Imagine her surprise.
>
> I rather be a regular guy and have the old lady
> climbing up the walls.
> SPIDERMAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> And now you are worried that we are talking about
> JJ watt and telling us to stop?
>
> The above quote was about David Boston, BTW...and
> we aren't signing him either.
>
> How about you worry about what you post? K?


LOL Just saying you are daydreaming with watt.


He will never become a phin.

Whats the matter joe...the wife didnt make supper last night?

HAHA.

BTW i did not tell you to stop.

Just made a comment.

And stand by it.

Watt is a daydream and will never become a dolfin.

I wish he would..!!

But maybe in our next life!!!!

samsam3738 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> LOL Just saying you are daydreaming with watt.
>
>
> He will never become a phin.
>
> Whats the matter joe...the wife didnt make supper
> last night?
>
> HAHA.

Wife? Just what I need... another person telling me what to do.

Barry Jackson ?@flasportsbuzz 5m5 minutes ago
Dolphins sign Jason fox

Oh joy...2 year, 2.5 mil for a mediocre backup. Hopefully they actually use him this team if needed instead of useless Dallas Thomas.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/05/2015 08:13AM by JoeFootball.

samsam3738 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Barry Jackson ?@flasportsbuzz 5m5 minutes ago
> Dolphins sign Jason fox


See! you are off topic. What does this have to do with Suh? LOL



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/05/2015 08:15AM by JoeFootball.

samsam3738 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Barry Jackson ?@flasportsbuzz 5m5 minutes ago
> Dolphins sign Jason fox

Honestly Sam, what does this have to do with signing Suh, stay on topic

JoeFootball Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Oh joy...2 year, 2.5 mil for a mediocre backup.
> Hopefully they actually use him this team if
> needed instead of useless Dallas Thomas.

I don't have a problem with it as long as Philbin will actually use him this year if needed.

JoeFootball Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> samsam3738 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > LOL Just saying you are daydreaming with watt.
> >
> >
> > He will never become a phin.
> >
> > Whats the matter joe...the wife didnt make
> supper
> > last night?
> >
> > HAHA.
>
> Wife? Just what I need... another person telling
> me what to do.


Tell me about it.

BIATCHES.

THE Truth Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> No way I'd offer him more than
> Jj Watt. He's not a better player.


&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&
He may not be better, but he may be more impactful.

The question to you is, what matters more? I know what my answer is.

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"

Too bad the rest of the line is falling apart as well. We still need more talent on the front 4.

Aqua&Orange Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> THE Truth Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> > No way I'd offer him more than
> > Jj Watt. He's not a better player.
>
>
> &&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&
> He may not be better, but he may be more
> impactful.
>
> The question to you is, what matters more? I know
> what my answer is.


I don't think he's more impactful but to each his own.

I think Watt is the better player, And with two separate 20+ sack seasons, 4 or 5 TD's in the last 2 years, and how many deflected passes(???)in his career I don't think its that close...


Suh has played 5 season, watt has played 4.

Watt can play DT or DE. Suh can't.

In 4 seasons Watt has 294 total tackles, 57 sacks, 12 forced Fumbles, 11 recovered fumbles, 1 INT, 1 DTD, 37 tipped passes and 3 offensive TD's

In 5 seasons Suh has 239 total tackles, 39 sacks, 2 Forced Fumbles, 1 Fumble recovery 1 INT, 0 D TD's, and 15 pass deflections.


Suh is a fantastic player, but when it comes to impact on the field, Watt is THE man...and its not even close.

Stats don't show the full picture of impact.

But whatever, I'm on to a different point.

The bottom line with Suh is this:

The Phins lost 3 games in 2014 in the very last seconds of those games. With Suh, the Phins are 3-0 in those games.

Simply put, the Dolphins are an 11 or 12 win team with Suh & in the playoffs.

Is that worth his contract for you? I know my answer.

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"

Aqua&Orange Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Stats don't show the full picture of impact.
>
> But whatever, I'm on to a different point.
>
> The bottom line with Suh is this:
>
> The Phins lost 3 games in 2014 in the very las
> seconds of those games. With Suh, the Phins are
> 3-0 in those games.

That's a major stretch. We lost those games on last second drives. Pass rushing isn't Suh's specialty. Assuming that he stops all three of those drives by his presence on the field is fantasy.


>
> Simply put, the Dolphins are an 11 or 12 win team
> with Suh & in the playoffs.
>
> Is that worth his contract for you? I know my
> answer.


I think he makes us a better team but he won't be joining last years defense. We lose Odrick, Wheeler, Ellerbe, and probably Starks.

At the end of the day, I'd like to sign him. But i'm not interested in overpaying for him. He's not a "got to have him at all costs" type player.

JJ Watt is.

If I can get him for a few bucks more than McCoy got then I'm interested. If I have to go beyond that, I'm not.

But that's me.

Suh makes your entire defense better. By taking on consistent double and triple teaming he forces one on one for the other dlinemen. He also makes blitzing more efficient. Imagine what Wake and Vernon would do w/ one on one blocking. The qb is forced into sacks, incompletions or better ints. Not knocking Watts he is the best DE in the game but Suhs impact is felt thu out the entire D.

are you kiddin 3 more wins and we in the playoffs.


Definetely worth it man.

THE Truth Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Aqua&Orange Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Stats don't show the full picture of impact.
> >
> > But whatever, I'm on to a different point.
> >
> > The bottom line with Suh is this:
> >
> > The Phins lost 3 games in 2014 in the very las
> > seconds of those games. With Suh, the Phins are
> > 3-0 in those games.
>
> That's a major stretch. We lost those games on
> last second drives. Pass rushing isn't Suh's
> specialty. Assuming that he stops all three of
> those drives by his presence on the field is
> fantasy.

I don't know about that. Suh is not better than Watt PERIOD!

It's also more likely than not than fantasy that by replacing Odrick with Suh, we don't let those teams run the ball on us AND also throw in a sack or two for Suh and Wake for even more impact in the passing game...maybe an interception on a pressure throw.

Pass rushing is not Suh's specialty? I'm not sure what that means exactly but if you mean he is better against the run then OK. Suh is still an elite pass rushing 4-3 DT.

Warren Sapp (pass rush was his specialty) had 29.5 sacks over his first 4 years. McCoy had 18.5. John Randle had 34.5.

Suh had 27.5. That's right among the best at his position.

> > Simply put, the Dolphins are an 11 or 12 win
> team
> > with Suh & in the playoffs.
> >
> > Is that worth his contract for you? I know my
> > answer.
>
>
> I think he makes us a better team but he won't be
> joining last years defense. We lose Odrick,
> Wheeler, Ellerbe, and probably Starks.

Ellerbe wasn't there and losing him is addition by subtraction. Wheeler is replaced by any number of people....Misi...
Suh/Mitchell > Odrick/Starks. Only one of those players (as of today) commands a CONSTANT double team and can still consistently beat that double team.

>
> At the end of the day, I'd like to sign him. But
> i'm not interested in overpaying for him. He's
> not a "got to have him at all costs" type player.
>
> JJ Watt is.

If you put it that way....no one is. Not even Watt.

>
> If I can get him for a few bucks more than McCoy
> got then I'm interested. If I have to go beyond
> that, I'm not.
>
> But that's me.

McCoy is in the same league as Suh. No doubt... but he hasn't produced the same impact. He has missed 16 games in 5 years. Suh has missed only 2 and McCoy isn't nearly as good vs the run.

McCoy is also not available. Not very often does a FA like this come along. Teams lock up JJ Watt and Gerald McCoy....and Suh, unless they are cap screwed.

That drives the price up a bit....availability.

Suh should get somewhere between the two if all things were fair....but neither of those two made it to FA.

I'm torn but very intrigued...it's hard to not get excited about the possibilities.

Or we could sign Haoli Ngata, Stephen Paea AND still have money left

mizzou15 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Suh makes your entire defense better. By taking on
> consistent double and triple teaming he forces one
> on one for the other dlinemen. He also makes
> blitzing more efficient. Imagine what Wake and
> Vernon would do w/ one on one blocking. The qb is
> forced into sacks, incompletions or better ints.
> Not knocking Watts he is the best DE in the game
> but Suhs impact is felt thu out the entire D.


Watt gets double and triple teamed just as much as Suh, if not more. He's the only DLineman Houston has that is any good. Suh has played with high 1st round talents like Ezekial Ansah and Nick Fairly.

As for who makes their defense better by his presence...its Watt, not Suh.

In the only defensive stat that matters, points allowed, Detroit has ranked 3rd, 15th, 27th, 23rd AND 19TH during Suh's time in the motor city (2014-2010).

Houston has ranked 7th, 24th, 9th an 4th in Watt's 4 years with the Texans.

Again, Suh is a fantastic player, but the idea that he's worth whatever he wants simply because he frees up other players to dominate the game is a fallacy. And the notion that he's a better or more impactful player than JJ watt is a joke.