This is a moderated phorum for the CIVILIZED discussion of the Miami Dolphins. In this phorum, there are rules and moderators to make sure you abide by the rules. The moderators for this phorum are JC and Colonel.
We have no idea what Turner is at this point. He hasn't gotten so much as a snap. That being said, I agree with your point. I don't believe Colledge is better than Smith but he continues to stick the one trick pony at LG. The guy is supposed to be a pass protection specialist but he can't even do that half the time. He has given up 5 sacks at LG! Just one less than the turnstile known as D-Thomas. Smith has given up 1 at LG.
I do remember last year when Dallas Thomas was red-shirted just as Turner has been this year. Turns out that was probably the right decision.
The one main problem I have with Philbin is his lack of aggressiveness in critical games.
Honestly, I knew we were in trouble v the Ravens when he opted for the 46 yd FG, instead of going for 4th and less than 1.
Safe was attempting to go up 10-0 on a fairly long FG. Although , I'm not sure how safe of a gamble that was with Sturgis kicking. He's not exactly automatic.
Shit! Flacco was QB sneaking for 3-4 yds. You're telling me that Tannehill couldn't get 2 1/2 feet on a quick count?! BS!
Gaining a 1st down there makes a statement, and sets a tone for the rest of your team.
Instead, that FG actually killed our momentum. We scored a whopping 3 points thereafter.
In game management and player motivation is where I think Philbin really falls short.
I'd agree at this point. Question we have to ask ourselves is are we happy to not press the edge and strive to be great each year, and just be satisfied with a slow building process while remaining 15-16th best team in the league each year? I say it's superbowl or bust and we need to get a staff that thinks the same way. I'm exhausted with play it safe coaches after Sparano.
It's all guess work and speculation for us fans at this point, IMO.
How much does losing players to IR affect your team? I would say that all depends on how established you are as a contender with quality depth.
SF was a pretty balanced team with plenty of star players. They have been building for years and even made 3 conference championship games, winning one. They have 12-15 players on either IR or NFI list. They are 7-6. As soon as they lost a couple players on th e o-line, the entire offense started to struggle. Even the highly touted QB.
The Giants are 4 years removed from winning the SuperBowl and 4 years from the SB prior to that. I believe they lead the NFL in IR players with 20! They are 4-9.
These are two fairly established teams that are struggling due to injuries.
Miami is a team in somewhat of a rebuilding mode and just got a new GM and OC. They were charged with rebuilding, arguable the worst offensive line in NFL history, in one season. They also juggled positions because of non IR issues like suspensions and players rehabbing from last year but not on PUP or IR. Miami has 13 players in reserve although 2 of them are developmental type players.
I think this season would be a different story had we been able to start all 5 linemen all season (or with just minimal injuries). We weren't really established enough to overcome many injuries. Especially on the o-line. They would have still struggled at the guard position (at times) but we would have been pretty decent.
Satele wouldn't have been getting knocked around by big DT's as they would have faced Pouncey.
What if Clay wasn't banged up all year? he doesn't show up on IR but his injuries have kept him from contributing to an improving offense.
How about losing 3 CB's and a FS?
So, has JP made some mistakes? Absolutely. They are just magnified because of many other issues.
I'm not sure what the right move is at this point. Fire him? Keep him? People are worried about losing Lazor in the process but we don't really know how much of the offensive success and failures are due to him. Yes, we have seen the failures too. You can't give him all of the credit and none of the blame.
Maybe Tannehill deserves a lot of credit for his season. How much more successful would he/we be if our line was healthy and Lazor wasn't forcing him into carrying the offense by abandoning a successful run game? The play calling hasn't exactly been stellar either.
Maybe our new o-line coach deserves some credit for establishing a run game out of a patchwork and rebuilt line.
Dennis Hickey for assembling this team from the scrap heap.
How about our rookie WR and young RB's?
I don't think Lazor will make or break Tannehill. There's nothing that innovative that he brings to Miami. It's a west coast offense with the read option play mixed in. I think he's a step up from the old goat, Sherman but he is not the messiah of offense.
There are just so many factors and everyone is used to blaming the HC.
Maybe, he will never be a great mind like Shula or Bellichick. But maybe all he needed was less injuries at rebuilt positions OR just a few more good players.
It's hard to judge fairly when it's based on speculation and "what if's".
I've had this inner battle going on inside my head since Sunday (no it's not will they ever find Bigfoot) about my thoughts on Tannehill, Hickey, Philbin and the rest of the coaches, I truly have no clue as to what I want if the season were to end today.
Is Tannehill the real deal with improved players around him? Does he warrant the next big contract?
Should Philbin be fired if we go 8-8/9-7? Who should we go after if he is fired, Harbaugh, Rex, Mike Smith, Nolan, Todd Bowles, Lazor, etc.?
Is Hickey getting too much praise for one decent off-season because we are all jaded from the Ireland years?
The questions go on and on, with no real answers, frustrating to say the least.
Possibly. The draft produced 2 players in the first year that look to be solid starter material with big upside. First two rounds where it's not as difficult. What about the rest? They have done nothing this year. May be too early to grade the draft class but next year will tell. He has earned another year IMO.
He has shown me enough growth that I offer him a contract after this year if he stays on pace. Thought being that we can get him cheaper now. Something in between the Alex Smith to Tom Brady range. That's in the 15 mil range. If we fill the right spots this year and he tears it up in year 4. We are stuck with a 100 mil/20 mil per year (Matt Ryan) contract.
Even if we draft another QB in 2015, it won't be in the top 3 rounds. If Tannehill stinks it up in 2015 and we have to draft one in the first round in 2016, his contract can be structured to take the cap hits and guaranteed money out by 2017 so it doesn't kill us.
It's most likely he is NOT going to stink it up and can be that game manager for the next couple of years until they decide to pull the trigger on somebody different. It's even more likely he becomes a very good weapon if we can stay healthy and add a play maker.
We can also use him while we groom another QB. I doubt we will be picking higher than 15ish so top guy will be hard to come by.
I think he just keeps getting better. He has the tools, work ethic and mindset. He is also tough AND durable. It could be worse...see Sam Bradford, Carson Palmer.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/10/2014 07:53AM by JoeFootball.
I think the whole "we should be playing this guy" being blamed on philbin is nonsense. Do you not think lazor and Benton have a say in the oline roster? so if we put turner in does that limit the playbook?
That said if Philbin is canned I think it's a pipe dream to get Harbaugh. If we're going to get an experienced HC I'm thinking Ryan, Mangini, or Shanahan and are we really better off?
I think our problems stem from a lack of talent. Our QB is limited. After 2.5 years of failing to stretch the field they've eliminated it from the gameplan.
Not counting this year our last 6 drafts have yielded exactly 0 difference makers in the first 4 rounds. ZERO. The core of our roster should be from those drafts. I can't think of one pending FA I'd offer a big contract to.
> I think the whole "we should be playing this guy"
> being blamed on philbin is nonsense. Do you not
> think lazor and Benton have a say in the oline
> roster? so if we put turner in does that limit
> the playbook?
I'm not so sure there isn't some blame to be had there. Look at Jelaney Jenkins. He was sitting behind Ellerbe and Wheeler and was a clear upgrade as soon as he stepped on the field.
> That said if Philbin is canned I think it's a pipe
> dream to get Harbaugh. If we're going to get an
> experienced HC I'm thinking Ryan, Mangini, or
> Shanahan and are we really better off?
Just shoot me now. I don't want any of those as HC but I'll take Ryan as a DC. Maybe Kyle Shanahan. Not Mike.
> I think our problems stem from a lack of talent.
> Our QB is limited. After 2.5 years of failing to
> stretch the field they've eliminated it from the
Not exactly the case, IMO. RT has struggled at times but blame can be assigned to WR's as well as the QB. It's not like he has never hit a deep ball. I do agree that they should not have eliminated it but passes over 40 yards are a very small percentage of the offense and it should not keep us from winning. We do have a lack of talent but it's because the talent is in the training room. We could also use more but just at a few positions.
> Not counting this year our last 6 drafts have
> yielded exactly 0 difference makers in the first 4
> rounds. ZERO. The core of our roster should be
> from those drafts. I can't think of one pending
> FA I'd offer a big contract to.
ZERO? granted 2013 was a joke except for Jenkins and Sims has shown signs of growing into a quality TE BUT...
Ryan Tannehill: He has been a huge part of our wins and even less to do with our losses EVEN though our line is in constant flux.
Lamar Miller: Should be among the league leaders at this point but is being under used.
Olivier Vernon: One of the best all around DE's in the game and still young.
Mike Pouncey: Out of position and playing next to inferior players.
Charles Clay: injured all year
Jared Odrick: Quality player and our best DT.
Brian Hartline: Not sure what happened there but consecutive 1k seasons.
Reshad Jones: 6th round but does it matter where? We all know he is a player.
Vontae Davis & Sean Smith: Making a difference for other teams.
That's not a bad core right there. It doesn't matter how much talent you have if they are all on crutches. No, they are not enough and I would agree with that BUT it's not ZERO.
Everyone wants to assign blame to one person or thing but it's never that simple. Put all the reasons together without talent and you get the first pick in the draft. Put them together with talent and you get mediocrity (8-8).
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/11/2014 06:50AM by JoeFootball.