I saw that link. There is nothing there where anyone says anything like Ryan is a once-in-a-generation talent. In fact on it the guy from the chargers said he wanted manning but took leaf b/c he could not move up to #1.
I also remember that draft very well, and no one was making the kind of claims about Leaf (or Manning) they are making about Luck. Again, everyone can be wrong about Luck, we won't know that till he actually plays in the NFL. But I am not talking about hindsight, I am talking about what is being said about Luck *now* vs what was said about other prospects *at the time they entered the draft*

Well, look at it from another angle, berk. You are now a 2011 man living in 2011 and thus have easy access to and are listening to all the hype about Luck as it is occurring.

However, you are not back in 1998 and surrounded by the hype about Ryan Leaf and Peyton Manning occurring at that time LIVE!

When you say you "remember that draft very well" you really don't expect to "feel that atmosphere LIVE" as you would if you were in 1998, do you?

So you are basically talking about Hindsight. I think people can compare Babe Ruth to Mantle as players.

But people really can't compare the "hype" as to Ruth and Mantle because they took place at different times.

The only thing one can say is, as my side has said, "I remember there was hype over...."

And to tell the truth, berk, I'm not trying to be obstinate but I really don't think there is as much hype about Luck as there was about Leaf and Manning, nor do I think there was as much hype about all three than there was about a fellow named Orenthal James Simpson when he came out of USC.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/30/2011 10:33AM by ChyrenB.

ChyrenB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Well, look at it from another angle, berk. You
> are now a 2011 man living in 2011 and thus have
> easy access to and are listening to all the hype
> about Luck as it is occurring.
>
> However, you are not back in 1998 and surrounded
> by the hype about Ryan Leaf and Peyton Manning
> occurring at that time LIVE!
>
> When you say you "remember that draft very well"
> you really don't expect to "feel that atmosphere
> LIVE" as you would if you were in 1998, do you?
>
> So you are basically talking about Hindsight. I
> think people can compare Babe Ruth to Mantle as
> players.
>
> But people really can't compare the "hype" as to
> Ruth and Mantle because they took place at
> different times.
>
> The only thing one can say is, as my side has
> said, "I remember there was hype over...."
>
> And to tell the truth, berk, I'm not trying to be
> obstinate but I really don't think there is as
> much hype about Luck as there was about Leaf and
> Manning, nor do I think there was as much hype
> about all three than there was about a fellow
> named Orenthal James Simpson when he came out of
> USC.

HU....?

You twist things so much you lost me............................

Let me fork out my lucky dictionary to try and comprehend what you just said man.

BTW im reading everything and enjoying the whole debate silently.

I actually remember the hype surrounding manning and leaf very well and no one was saying the sort of stuff they are saying about luck. I have never heard any of the superlatives heaped on luck said about any prospective draftee(I was alive but but too young to care about what was said re elway in 1983). I will give you this though---the draft itself was not hyped to the degree it is now when manning/leaf came out, so everything said today is magnified compared to years past.

It's quite simple berk, You don't have access to the 1998 hype in 2011. You say you are a lawyer too so that shouldn't be so difficult to understand.

And if you think your memory is as good as being in 1998 right now, then that statement is incredible in and of itself.

I have excellent recall of useless facts

Look guys,every couple years there is tremendous hype surrounding certain Qb's. Tremendous to say this year is any more hype then years past is not really fair. Recollections of hindsight 6months into the season normally washes away alot of it.. Let alone years later. Look there was tremendous hyp about Sam Bradford. I have heard that he is the best QB pro ready to come out and years and the closest thing to a sure thing QB pick... SO to say one years hype out hyped all other years is not really fair.. Also the world was very different years back. Blogs didnt really exist, the NFL network didnt really exist, the 24 hour sports channel was just Sportscenter or live sports, none of this talking head pundits 12 hours a day on alot more channels,etc..you get the point



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/30/2011 11:16AM by Crowder52.

Ryan Leaf only became a top prospect because of his physical abilities. But I clearly remember people saying he came with serious "red-flags" due to his character issues.

Andrew Luck has zero concernes. Physical, mental, character, leadership, or any other thing you can dissect. He has zero flaws.

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"

Luck is the man. Will be the man, and is going to be our man!!! YEAH BIG (o)(o)'s!!! AND B!R!!!!!

Aqua&Orange Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Andrew Luck has zero concernes. Physical, mental,
> character, leadership, or any other thing you can
> dissect. He has zero flaws.

Funny your use of words, there is a youtube clip from 2002 draft day floating around, where Jaws calls Joey Harrington Flawless , Maybe you should find a better choice of words, cause zero flaws and flawless lost alot of meaning and power of the word, that have been used in describing NFL QB draft prospects from Joey Harrington to Andrew Luck, for obvious reasons...lol

Thats only Ron Jaworski who said that. Plenty of other pundits thought Joey had serious concerns.


Name me 1 single pundit who has critisized anything about Andrew Luck.

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"

CryneB did.

Aqua&Orange Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thats only Ron Jaworski who said that. Plenty of
> other pundits thought Joey had serious concerns.
>
>
> Name me 1 single pundit who has critisized
> anything about Andrew Luck.


Well there was everone from Chris Berman to Mort to Mel Kiper sitting there and no one questioned or crticised Harrington in any way, all they did was praise. Please show me the example of other big name pundits showing any concerns let alone serious concern about Harrington predraft as you suggest. I dont think it exist, it only exist in hindsight

Deigol090 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> CryneB did.


A little respect in your voice when you say that.

Pundits taking a stance is very different then a scouting report. Are you saying that I cant find a scounting report that addresses concerns with Andrew Luck?

Well its alot easier to find info on Luck coming out, since its RIGHT NOW.


Then, when Harrington came out nearly 10 years ago.

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"

Aqua&Orange Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Well its alot easier to find info on Luck coming
> out, since its RIGHT NOW.
>
>
> Then, when Harrington came out nearly 10 years
> ago.


I agree, but it seems that if you feel Harrington had major concerns based on this type of scouting report, Andrew Luck has similar if not more concerns. He has concern about arm strength, pocket presence, making reads, and locking on to one receiver and throwing off his backfoot or off balance...

Funny. We're back to where we were when Drew Brees came out. We not only had a chance to draft Brees, but with Fiedler hurt it was blatantly obvious that we needed a QB. I know we passed on Brees, but I've heard a number of people say that if Brees WOULD have been drafted he would have been wasted in Miami (with Wanny as a coach) and would, ultimately, have been let go anyway.

So, now Andrew Luck comes up. So, if we DO have a chance at taking him, do we pass again because we don't have the team or organization to really utilize his talent?! I don't know.

Yeah, but Brees went in the first part of the second round. I don't doubt that Luck will go first, regardless of whether I think we SHOULD pick him. But we won't be able to pass on him at the end of the first round like we passed on Brees to pick ....was it Jamar Fletcher?

Do you remember the lines," If we build it, he will come" from Field of Dreams? Sure you do.

We don't have to design to lose (fail) we are on that track right now.

"If we play, we will lose" is self evident. Our bed is made.

How many might we win? 1? 2? maybe 3? Will we snap victory from defeat in our own conference? Probably not. Buffalo is on a roll; the Jets are pretty darn good, and the Pats only get better. We will not win one of these games.

I'm looking forward to SD game, and will wear my Dolphin apparel and hope for a victory--because that's what I really want. But I will not be surprised when a punt is returned, a long TD throw is made, and the TEs make a dozen catches, some between the red zones, some in the end zones against us. Will we score today? Field goals? Probably. 1? 2? at best. Certainly not more than that. How many times will Henne be sacked? 3? 4? 5? times. Maybe. How many turnovers will we have. 1? 2? maybe 3?

What about ill-timed "timeouts?" Probably 2, maybe more. We will also see a few penalties stop our momentum.

Will the game be close? No. I believe there will be a 21 point difference as Rivers will play well. He will not be sacked. He will throw for 300-400 yards easily. Our secondary will be confused.

I could go on, but why beat a dead horse any more? "If we play, we will lose." This franchise can't help it right now.

Sporano will be done after the jets game. We will be 0-5 and in our way to Luck

If we draft him, with our luck, he will suck.

Again, you like to make an apples-oranges comparison sound reasonable. It's not. However, whatever he is now, OJ was a great college back, and he became a great pro. That hype was justified.

Rick