Each of the 4 teams in the conference championship games are sporting starting QB's who are ALL FIRST ROUND DRAFT PICKS. The writing is on the wall, draft a QB.

Odenn Wrote:
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> Each of the 4 teams in the conference championship
> games are sporting starting QB's who are ALL FIRST
> ROUND DRAFT PICKS. The writing is on the wall,
> draft a QB.


I agree Odenn ,besides we havent drafted a QB in the first rd since Marino... and we havent had much success at the position since the last time we drafted one in the first rd, end of story...

If you think that a first round QB is what it takes then look again. It takes a complete team. Offense, Defense and Special Teams. All of the teams left have that. The SB winner will have a complete team.

This year it would surprise me if we draft a QB in the first round. It won't do us a bit of good unless we draft in the top 2 or 3 and I really don't see that happening.
So, build the team and get the "caretaker" that Phinsfan likes to say. That will put us in a position to start trading and move up high enough next draft if necessary.

I'm not saying we don't need great QB, of coarse we do. I just don't see us moving up high enough in the draft to get someone any better than we should be able to get in trade or FA. Assuming that a new contract is signed.

So all of this talk of drafting and moving up is just that. TALK.

Leon In Denver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If you think that a first round QB is what it
> takes then look again. It takes a complete team.
> Offense, Defense and Special Teams. All of the
> teams left have that. The SB winner will have a
> complete team.
>
> This year it would surprise me if we draft a QB in
> the first round. It won't do us a bit of good
> unless we draft in the top 2 or 3 and I really
> don't see that happening.
> So, build the team and get the "caretaker" that
> Phinsfan likes to say. That will put us in a
> position to start trading and move up high enough
> next draft if necessary.
>
> I'm not saying we don't need great QB, of coarse
> we do. I just don't see us moving up high enough
> in the draft to get someone any better than we
> should be able to get in trade or FA. Assuming
> that a new contract is signed.
>
> So all of this talk of drafting and moving up is
> just that. TALK.

I'm sorry but I respectfully disagree with your point of view that next year is a throw away "rebuilding" type of year. This team went 7-9. Not 3-13. With a better QB this team could have easily been 3-4 wins better, with a possible playoff birth. I refuse to think that building the foundations while ignoring the QB position until next year is a viable answer for this organization any longer. Besides, drafting a QB now will ensure the FO knows what he needs to be successful in the long term all the more quickly.

If you've read phinsfan's qb draft bust rate post you know that drafting a qb outside of the first round is paramount to playing the lotto. If you're going to want a replacement at the QB position from the draft, you do it in the first round. Not doing so would be a waste.

Odenn Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Leon In Denver Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > If you think that a first round QB is what it
> > takes then look again. It takes a complete
> team.
> > Offense, Defense and Special Teams. All of the
> > teams left have that. The SB winner will have a
> > complete team.
> >
> > This year it would surprise me if we draft a QB
> in
> > the first round. It won't do us a bit of good
> > unless we draft in the top 2 or 3 and I really
> > don't see that happening.
> > So, build the team and get the "caretaker" that
> > Phinsfan likes to say. That will put us in a
> > position to start trading and move up high
> enough
> > next draft if necessary.
> >
> > I'm not saying we don't need great QB, of
> coarse
> > we do. I just don't see us moving up high
> enough
> > in the draft to get someone any better than we
> > should be able to get in trade or FA. Assuming
> > that a new contract is signed.
> >
> > So all of this talk of drafting and moving up
> is
> > just that. TALK.
>
> I'm sorry but I respectfully disagree with your
> point of view that next year is a throw away
> "rebuilding" type of year. This team went 7-9. Not
> 3-13. With a better QB this team could have easily
> been 3-4 wins better, with a possible playoff
> birth. I refuse to think that building the
> foundations while ignoring the QB position until
> next year is a viable answer for this organization
> any longer. Besides, drafting a QB now will ensure
> the FO knows what he needs to be successful in the
> long term all the more quickly.

Either you did not completely read what I wrote or I did not express myself properly.
I know we need a QB upgrade. I know we are closer than most people seem to think. By continuing to build the team, OL, RB, D, WR or whatever we can do AND with a QB upgrade we could very well be in the playoffs next year.
I'm just saying that there are not enough good QBs in this draft for us to get that "diamond" we would like.
If a new contract is signed then we should be able to pick up a QB by trade or FA or whatever that can at least get us to the playoffs.

Now if you see a way that we can trade up without depleting our team and pick a true franchise QB then you see something that I don't.

If we give up what we have to trade up and get a top QB then we will be at least 3 to 4 years away and we will then see the team clean house of coaches and start over. I for one do not want to see that.

I remember arguing that point (QB R1) a few months back and being attacked, assaulted and thoroughly pummeled mentally. Lucky I’m still 50% psychologically capable. Maybe.

Funny. Where have all the Henne lovers gone?

That could be a country song.



QB #1 and then AGAIN in like R4 or so. I WANT LOTS of new possibilities.

No more focking around. Yo idiots. Just do it. And shut up.

I would definetely like to see Henne under a different system, but that being said, until we have our QB of the future on our team for sure, we should keep doubling down IMO. I wouldnt cut Henne either... I just want success, and yes I think Henne's success was limited by David Lee and Dan Henning... AM I positive he is the Qb of the future, NO... That is what is hard to get through with all of the Henne bashing that was going on, nobody was happy with his inconsistency. At times when we had a running game, he played well... Other times he played awful, but most of that time, we had failed to develop a running game and tried to pass out of a power formation 30 times a game.... Henning failed with Marshall as well, the guy had his worst year a a pro... SO did ronnie and ricky not incluing injury or partial years..

I'd cut him with a chain saw.

I understand both points of view but I think it is a little early and presumptuous to say that no QB this year can be had for a #15 pick. The top 15 teams have not even finished their evaluations of the top prospects yet so we as fans really are spectators in the evaluation process and are way behind on the insight needed to evaluate a QB.

Cutler was taken at 11, Rodgers at 24, Roethlisberger at 11 and Sanchez at 5.

Sure every year is different but it is also a big unknown when guys will go. Rodgers dropped big time in the draft and some would say that Sanchez and Ben were taken too early based on what they knew then.

Some teams will pass on Newton and some will fall in love and try anything to move up to get him.

No one goes into the draft saying "we will be worse next year so lets wait until we have a higher pick". You kind of have to take it while you got it.

#15 is a pretty good spot in the draft. We really don't have the ammo to move up without a 2nd round pick and the inability to trade players for picks.

It all comes down to talent evaluation. They (as a GM) have to assign your own draft grades to see who's worthy or not but one thing is certain. We have to come out of this draft with a difference maker at 15 or really get some great value for trading down....like two second rounders or something...and then make those picks count.

And then sometimes you have to gamble. Especially when jobs are on the line like they actually are.

There are no FA QB's available this year that are sure things and we won't even be allowed to give up draft picks to get a player this year due to no CBA.

Job security will be decides by the draft this year. We have to get a star/ difference maker in the first couple rounds.

What has it been??? 28 years since we drafted a first round QB??? Wow.

I honestly believe we can't afford to draft a RB or WR in the first round. QB offers the most value and potential. If we can get one (big if) that has a rookie year like Bradford (which was good because he showed potential....but not great...win wise or numbers wise) then it buys the coaches/GM a little more time.

Get a lineman or RB that has a good year (1k rusher or ROY candidate at Center (ala Pouncey of 2010 draft) and still fail to show that we have a viable future at QB...then people will get fired.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

ChyrenB Wrote:
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> No one has addressed A & O's point. Odenn started
> out by pointing out that all four quarterbacks
> remaining in the playoffs were drafted in the
> first round. That makes you think that this is
> powerful evidence for the need for us to draft a
> QB in the first round.
>

I tried to show it wasnt potluck it happend, by the fact that 9 out of the 12 Qb's in this years playoff's were picked in the first 33 picks... That is pretty strong IMO and something that should not be shrugged off.... and the ones that were not the teams had the convenience of not making QB a priority...

the only point that should matter:

we've been looking for a new QB for 12+ years. We've done everything in that time to get one EXCEPT spend a 1st rounder on one. If there is one who is worthy of the pick, you have to do it.

you guys who are advocating taking one in the 2d, 3d or lower rounds, are you serious? have you been paying attention since the marino years?

Again, I think your franchise QB is found in the 1st round.

You want Peyton Manning? Have the #1 Overall pick. You want Matt Ryan? Have the #2 pick. You want most of the franchise QB's in this league as your QB? You gotta take them in the 1st round.


Of course you can find one later, but you can also try taking a row boat from South Carolina to England.....just not sure it is a smart idea, though.

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/20/2011 01:38PM by Aqua&Orange.

Ryan leaf, Akili Smith, Alex Smith, David Carr, Jamarcus Russell were all first rounders too

and you can get a good look at a t-bone by sticking your head up a cows ass but wouldn't you rather just ask the butcher?

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

jlyell13 Wrote:
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> Ryan leaf, Akili Smith, Alex Smith, David Carr,
> Jamarcus Russell were all first rounders too


so were Tony Mandarich, Brian Bozworth, Yatik Green, Jamar Flethcher, Jason Allen, Vernon Gholston,etc. what's the point

jlyell13 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ryan leaf, Akili Smith, Alex Smith, David Carr,
> Jamarcus Russell were all first rounders too

Leaf was a huge mistake that cost the GM his job. Both the Smith boys were drafted by perennial losers, Carr was drafted by Houston who has had like 1 winning season in their history and Russell was drafted by Al Davis (poster child for Alzheimer)...nuff said?

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

Aqua&Orange Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
...but you can also try taking a row boat from South Carolina to England.....just not sure it is a smart idea, though.



Dude I love this analogy.

In the above scenario Henna is a boat anchor, yes?

Quote:

"Dude I love this analogy."



&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&
I love the T-bone analogy myself!

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"

Phinsfan2,

Dude, what an intense post...

Can I just have like a sinus infection and forget the brain tumor?

With all those numbers and stuff I'm wondering what's behind door #3...

I get the argument about defense, running game, O-Line....but we've been doing that since Marino, and it's been a failure. So, I'm all for drafting a QB in the 1st round.

Think of it THIS way. How many times have we drafted a QB bust in the 1st round? ONCE. Rick Norton. 1966!!!

Phinsfan2 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> jlyell13 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Ryan leaf, Akili Smith, Alex Smith, David Carr,
> > Jamarcus Russell were all first rounders too
>
>
> So what. Really.
>
> I mean, what is your point...that there are bad
> QB's that have been selected in every round so we
> should never ever draft a QB?
>
> No offense, but the argument you are alluding to
> is asinine.
>
> This is ALL about PERCENTAGES.
>
> There are no 100% guarantees in life, let alone in
> the draft, but the best ODDS you can find for
> landing a franchise QB are IN THE FIRST ROUND OF
> THE DRAFT.
>
> Lets put it this way:
>
> Let's say that you are dying of a brain tumor.
>
> There are 7 doctors you can go to for an
> operation.
>
> Doctor #1 has a 44% survival rate on this
> particular surgery.
>
> Doctor #2 has a 25% survival rate.
>
> Doctor #3 has a 10% survival rate.
>
> Doctor #4 a 7% survival rate.
>
> Doctor #5 a 3% Survival rate.
>
> Doctor #6 checks in at less than 10%
>
> And Doctor # 7 gives you about a 4% chance of
> waking up the next day.
>
> Of course, statistics tell us that of the
> thousands of other doctors out there that have
> performed this particular surgery and that there
> were a handful of additional survivors from those
> cases, so your wife's OBGYN is an option as well.
>
>
> Real simple, your life on the line, which doctor
> are you going to select to perform that surgery?
>
> If your answer is anything OTHER than Doctor #1
> there's really no reason to respond.
>
>
> Of course this is where Leon in Denver chimes in
> and tells you that: "you don't have to have that
> tumor removed. You can treat it homeopathically
> and strengthen the rest of your body until they
> invent a brain transplant."

Why don't you keep your stupid comments about me to yourself. If you read any of my posts you would have never made that comment. You think because you are a moderator that you are some sort of authority. What I see as a fantasy player with stats and not much of anything else.

BigNastyFish Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Aqua&Orange Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> ...but you can also try taking a row boat from
> South Carolina to England.....just not sure it is
> a smart idea, though.
>
>
>
> Dude I love this analogy.
>
> In the above scenario Henna is a boat anchor, yes?

Nope. As everyone knows...$h1t FLOATS!

For any team to be successful for more than just a 1 year-Cinderella-stars-align-run you MUST have a top tier QB Period!

Having one may not GUARANTEE Success but the lack of one surely GUARANTEES the lack of success.

As the bust rates show, the most likely place to find a top tier QB is in the 1st round of the draft.

Even some of the 'Average' QB's people like to mention who took their teams to super bowls like McMahon(Bears) and Dilfer(Ravens) were 1st ROUND PICKS.

Quote:

"Nope. As everyone knows...$h1t FLOATS!"



&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&
Not necessarily. With a lack of fiber, sinkage.

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"

Aqua&Orange Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Quote:
>
> "Nope. As everyone knows...$h1t FLOATS!"
>
>
>
> &&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&
> Not necessarily. With a lack of fiber, sinkage.

I'm not going to ask how you know that.