1) Cameron Wake played like crap. He blew the outside leverage on the 3rd and 16 from the 20, got absolutely no pass rush (Woody owned him).

2) Jason Allen - jury is still out on him. I think the PI when he was covering B Edwards in the endzone was crap. He fell down on the Edwards TD. The only play I really think was his fault was letting Edwards catch the 3rd and long out route. Collinsworth hammered this point home.

3) Ronnie Brown looks slow. We didn't give Ricky any orbit carries. RW has lost his confidence. He needs a good game. Seems like they always do good against the Patriots though.

4) I read a whole thread on Bobby Carpenter here last week and sure enough he gives up the first touchdown. Great throw by Sanchez though.

5) We have the better QB in Henne. I can think of 3 throws where he put great touch on the ball. 1) The first one to Bess where he caught it out of bounds and we quick snapped after. 2) The next one shortly there after to Bess. The 3rd and long (16) to Hartline.

6) Bell should have tackled Smith on the cat play late in the 4th. Still, Bell is good. Good players sometimes miss tackles too.

7) We will bet the Jets in NY.

Can't wait for the Patriots.

8) When the Jets were flagged on one of our PAT's, the penalty was enforced on the ensuing kickoff. Carpenter should've been able to easily kick the ball out of the endzone. Instead, he kicked it short and Smith has a 50 or so yard return. Inexcusable.

ChambersDeepBall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 1) Cameron Wake played like crap. He blew the
> outside leverage on the 3rd and 16 from the 20,
> got absolutely no pass rush (Woody owned him).
>
He was held by Woody on more than one occasion. He still needs to work on defending the run, but he's a hard worker. That will come.

> 2) Jason Allen - jury is still out on him. I
> think the PI when he was covering B Edwards in the
> endzone was crap. He fell down on the Edwards TD.
> The only play I really think was his fault was
> letting Edwards catch the 3rd and long out route.
> Collinsworth hammered this point home.
>
He could have done things better, but I agree it isn't all on him.


> 3) Ronnie Brown looks slow. We didn't give Ricky
> any orbit carries. RW has lost his confidence.
> He needs a good game. Seems like they always do
> good against the Patriots though.
I have to agree as well. Neither player looked sharp.

>
> 4) I read a whole thread on Bobby Carpenter here
> last week and sure enough he gives up the first
> touchdown. Great throw by Sanchez though.
>
He was cut for a reason. We NEED Crowder back!

9) The penalty on the hit by Clemons was BS. How was he supposed to know Cotchery would drop it? That was on 3rd down I believe

ChambersDeepBall Wrote:
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> 9) The penalty on the hit by Clemons was BS. How
> was he supposed to know Cotchery would drop it?
> That was on 3rd down I believe
I agree 100%. Safeties are SUPPOSED to hit guys like that!! He didn't lead with his helmet, so he wasn't purposely trying to injure the WR.

GBOFinFan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 8) When the Jets were flagged on one of our PAT's,
> the penalty was enforced on the ensuing kickoff.
> Carpenter should've been able to easily kick the
> ball out of the endzone. Instead, he kicked it
> short and Smith has a 50 or so yard return.
> Inexcusable.

Carpenter is great on FGs and XPts, but he's far too inconsistent on kickoffs. Some go into the end zone; some go short; some go out of bounds. It's getting ridiculous. Our Special Teams has been anything but special since we let Westhoff leave.

The lack of pass rush is what hurt our defense.

We have *CREATED* all those defensive plays in the first 2 weeks with pass rush.

Our lack of pass rush made Sanchez look like a good NFL QB. That was our problem last night.

A pass rush helps Jason Allen out.

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"

10) If Langford picks off that pass from Sanchez and takes it in for the TD, Joe Robbie would have been rockin louder than it has in 10 years. SO EFFING CLOSE

ChambersDeepBall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 10) If Langford picks off that pass from Sanchez
> and takes it in for the TD, Joe Robbie would have
> been rockin louder than it has in 10 years. SO
> EFFING CLOSE

Tough one to catch.

montequi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ChambersDeepBall Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > 9) The penalty on the hit by Clemons was BS.
> How
> > was he supposed to know Cotchery would drop it?
>
> > That was on 3rd down I believe
> I agree 100%. Safeties are SUPPOSED to hit guys
> like that!! He didn't lead with his helmet, so he
> wasn't purposely trying to injure the WR.

IN FACT IF YOU LOOK AT THE REPLAY, HE TRIED TO HOLD UP AND STOP. HIS MOMENTUM CARRIED HIM INTO THE RECEIVER AND HE DIDN'T EVEN HIT THE GUY IN THE HELMET! I wonder about those refs sometime.

Anyone see the helmet to helmet hit that Ronnie took when he got leveled on that one play? No flag, but Clemons gets one for a shoulder hit

I am not happy with the final results of this game, but I am still very hopeful for this season. The team is growing and improving.

Good point: Henne showed us he can be very effective;

Bad points: the punt block situation can not happen again; kick-off coverage needs to improve; pass rush must be present.

IMHO the one good point outweighs the bad ones. There will be improvement on the bad points.

I have not seen much of Sancheze, but he looked pretty good last night.

Sanchez isn't a good QB. He had way to much time. You give Trent Dilfer all day to throw and he'll look like an elite QB with presence. Nuff said.

As for the Henne doubters: He showed me last night that he is in fact our QB of the future. I had my doubts, especially considering the preseason, but his performance last night ended what debate I had in my head. He has the tools, he just needs the time to develop. Especially now that he's got a monster of a WR in Marshall and a hell of a supporting WR core behind him. I can't stress enough how excited I am about our passing game after last night. After so many years of a ground and pound offense that lacked any deep big play potential, and after the failed Ginn experiment, I am f*(kin ecstatic now. We have one hell of an offense on our hands boys and girls. NFL take notice now, Henne and this offense is going to be putting up big numbers in the future.

We need some burt of something in the running game. Let's get Hilliard in there for a few carries a game, just to see what some younger legs can do.

Bess and Hartline stepped up last night. That was good to see.

Roberto Wallace was pretty active on special teams. He looked like he could make a pretty decent cover guy.

And we need cover guys, because kick coverage was awful (over 37 yards per attempt).

Our outside backers were terrible against the run. They lost containment on so many plays it was ridiculous. You can believe this is something that other teams are going to attack and attack until they prove they can handle it.

The pass rush was non-existent. Wake was shut down by Woody. We can't count on Wake to be the only pass rusher. Others need to step up in that situation.

ChyrenB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> IN FACT IF YOU LOOK AT THE REPLAY, HE TRIED TO
> HOLD UP AND STOP. HIS MOMENTUM CARRIED HIM INTO
> THE RECEIVER AND HE DIDN'T EVEN HIT THE GUY IN THE
> HELMET! I wonder about those refs sometime.

In fact Cotchery purposely put his head down and bulled it into Clemons. I've never liked the way Cotchery plays, least of all against us.

Regarding RB looking slow, Henning said he played the game with a slightly pulled hamstring

ChambersDeepBall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Regarding RB looking slow, Henning said he played
> the game with a slightly pulled hamstring


I really didn't notice ronnie been slow. I couldn't catch that but i did notice him not been as physical as in other games. Maybe im wrong.

As far as cameron wake i agree he didnt had a good game. He will get better with more reps. He has the size and strengh to get to the next level. I always wondered about wake's run support.

I think the passrush wasn't there because sanchez used those quick 2 step drop backs and delivered the ball rather quickly most of the times.

Brown is slower than he's been in previous seasons...all you have to do is look at his 51 yard run against Minnesota. Four years ago that would have been a touchdown...even with the angle the defender took.

IT seems Ronnie has always gotten caught from behind. He has never looked as fast as his 40 time IMO.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

I agree with eesti....I think ronnie gets caught on that play 4 years ago as well...On that minessotta 50 yard run. Hes never been a burner.

Sometimes I wonder about some of you. Never satisfied no matter how good a player is.
A running back doesn't need world class speed guys. Just hit the hole fast with power and break a few tackles. Catch the rock when it is thrown to you, then break another tackle. That's it boys, that's what's needed.

Leon In Denver Wrote:
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> Sometimes I wonder about some of you. Never
> satisfied no matter how good a player is.
> A running back doesn't need world class speed
> guys. Just hit the hole fast with power and break
> a few tackles. Catch the rock when it is thrown to
> you, then break another tackle. That's it boys,
> that's what's needed.


Oh leon im satisfied as hell with ronnie. Im a fan of ronnie. Im just saying he doesnt have peterson's type speed. I don't think thats a crime not to have peterson type speed.


Tell you what id be happy if we drafted another RB just like ronnie. And the only thing i would hope is that he doesnt get injured as much.

Even that RB that played on the same college team with ronnie got injured...the one tampa bay drafted..... Man that school is cursed.

Anyways its a rolls the dice situation. You draft a player and hope for the best. Unfortunatelly injuries are part of this sport and every sport. Well almost.....Except golf...wait a minute..........you can hurt your back making one of those gold swings.....

montequi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Carpenter is great on FGs and XPts, but he's far
> too inconsistent on kickoffs. Some go into the
> end zone; some go short; some go out of bounds.
> It's getting ridiculous. Our Special Teams has
> been anything but special since we let Westhoff
> leave.

I think this is the result of "called" kicks. That is, our ST coach calls a coverage and Carpenter is to kick to it. That is why the kick went OOB, the coach called a for the kick to be put in that corner and Carpenter didn't quite do it..... however that may be because the angle of the kick was not normal.

The thing here is that, if the ST coach is indeed calling kicks and coverages, he is doing a poor job of it.

DolfanMike Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> The thing here is that, if the ST coach is indeed
> calling kicks and coverages, he is doing a poor
> job of it.

The reason they should fire him already. How long is he been here. Probably a few years im guessing because we've stunk on special teams for a while now.

And havent you notice its a domino effect?

1.Kicks out of bounce.....

2.no long returns ((((((except for a couple of ginns longs returns against the jets last year.))))))....which means no decent blocking at all

3. Can't tackle.

4. Inconsistent punting......

The special teams coach is supposed to teach and doing a terrible job at it. Him and everybody else who works for him.

samsam3738 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> 4. Inconsistent punting......
>
Actually, punting (and FGs) are the only bright spots we've had on ST this regular season. On the other hand, blocking for punts has been atrocious. We've regressed since last year!! We're NOT supposed to do that.