MikeO Wrote:
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> college football is not a "lesser league"..
>
> it's different not lesser

Yes, it IS lesser... the gap in talent level among the teams in college is ridiculous! The fact that there are a dozen or so teams that go close to undefeated and have 20+ point victories in nearly every game proves that.

The same few schools are always in the championship discussion, why? Because college football is not about coaching, or who prepares better, it is about who has the reputation and dollars to attract all the top talents. Since there is no playoff the winning the championship really only takes winning ONE legitimate game per year... the rest are practically gimmes. We might as well just have Mel Kiper award the National Championship based on how the team's players ranks look going into the draft, it would be about as legitimate as the current system.

grooves12 Wrote:
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>
> Yes, it IS lesser... the gap in talent level among
> the teams in college is ridiculous! The fact that
> there are a dozen or so teams that go close to
> undefeated and have 20+ point victories in nearly
> every game proves that.
>
> The same few schools are always in the
> championship discussion, why? Because college
> football is not about coaching, or who prepares
> better, it is about who has the reputation and
> dollars to attract all the top talents. Since
> there is no playoff the winning the championship
> really only takes winning ONE legitimate game per
> year... the rest are practically gimmes. We might
> as well just have Mel Kiper award the National
> Championship based on how the team's players ranks
> look going into the draft, it would be about as
> legitimate as the current system.


Agree completely! And I'll go a step further and say that none of those top teams have any chance of beating the worst NFL team, EVER!

And even the best college, with their great talent, only have a handful of players that get drafted, and at most have only one or two players that can state and be effective on week one of a rookie season.

The worst NFL team will have players that are bigger and better at NEARLY EVERY POSITION. They would kill any college team.

Say Michigan has a year with a huge O-Line that beats every college team. They go up against the worst NFL team, and that NFL team will have D-Linemen living in the backfield every single play. Those NFL players on the WORST TEAMS will have all at one time been the biggest and the best of College players. All will be bigger and have gotten better against much tougher competition than even the best college team has to offer. And even though the men on the worst team can't beat another NFL team, they will abuse any group of college boys that line up against them. The college team will have no chance for a pass play and would be lucky to get positive yards running.

Really, it wouldn't even be close.

NCAA division one is the best of that age group and experience - no argument there. And NCAA is the genesis of the game - argument there. But the NFL is a Man's league not a Student's game. It is truly a "LESSER LEAGUE".

DolfanMike Wrote:
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> The worst NFL team will have players that are
> bigger and better at NEARLY EVERY POSITION. They
> would kill any college team.
>

Yep! I once saw a ridiculous game between one of the worst college teams at the time (William & Mary) and the "Japanese All-Stars" (yes, the best football players in Japan!!). W&M won the game 77-3. It was pitiful.

MikeO Wrote:
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> College football is played
> by college kids, its different, and it doesn't
> mean that guys like Joe Paterno or Bear Bryant
> could never coach in the NFL!!


True, but MOST college head coaches that have tried to coach in the NFL have failed. Jimmy Johnson in Dallas is an exception. Otherwise, success is rare. That's because college kids don't get paid so they're egos haven't fully developed. Coaches can be hardasses and get away with it in college. Pros require a different temperament of coach. In the Pros the coach and the player are almost equals. It's not the same in college.

oh my god, Jimmy Johnson is not the only college coach to make the jump successfully. What is it with you people....

Tom Coughlin
Bill Walsh
Jim Caldwell
Marv Levy
Barry Switzer
Steve Marriuci
Butch Davis (even led the Browns to the playoffs for christ sakes)

Maybe all didn't win a ring but all had nice NFL runs and success in the NFL. And I don't want to hear the "yeah but.." excuse. Because we can say..."yeah but...." about anybody even your precious Jimmy Johnson!!

MikeO Wrote:
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> oh my god, Jimmy Johnson is not the only college
> coach to make the jump successfully. What is it
> with you people....
>
> Tom Coughlin
> Bill Walsh
> Jim Caldwell
> Marv Levy
> Barry Switzer
> Steve Marriuci
> Butch Davis (even led the Browns to the playoffs
> for christ sakes)
>

Most of those coaches you list didn't make a "jump" from college.
Really, just because a guy did a few years in college early in his career doesn't mean he's a career "college coach" like Saban or Bryant.

Tom Coughlin, Marv Levy, Bill Walsh, and Butch Davis all spend considerable time in the NFL coaching ranks before they were successful Head Coaches. That is not a JUMP by any means.


The only Coaches you list that made a real "jump" to the NFL are Switzer and Mooch.


Switzer took over a team that basically ran itself. The first year, he won a SB with a team that was expected to win a SB. I wouldn't call that success - just pragmatism. He subsequently ran that team into a wall. I would call that failure.

Mooch is a great guy and an adequate coach, but his teams never really made an impact.



> Maybe all didn't win a ring but all had nice NFL
> runs and success in the NFL.

If you don't win a ring, then what is the point???? Successful coaches win rings.


> And I don't want to hear the "yeah but.." excuse.

OK, dad.


> Because we can
> say..."yeah but...." about anybody even your
> precious Jimmy Johnson!!

That is funny. I think JJ lucked out with the Cowboys and was huge mistake for the Dolphins. We should have stuck with Shula until Marino retired - I really think the Don had one more run in him. Instead we got a day tripper that left us with his incompetent flunky.

your lost on this topic. If your calling Barry Switzer a failure. And won't acknowledge that Tom Coughlin was a college coach that jumped to the NFL and was succesful then I don't know what to tell ya. You live in a fantasy world.

Switzer won. Period. Lots of coaches have taken over GREAT teams and lost with those GREAT teams. He won, can't knock him for that.

And if you are going to disqualify guys because they were pro assistants then became college head coaches before becoming NFL head coaches than your list of course starts and stops with Jimmy Johnson!! He's the only one (or one of like 3 guys) that fits that insane narrow minded criteria in NFL history probably.

Silly debate. By your logic Paterno and Bryant can't coach. And JJ is the only college coach who was "good" enough to jump to the NFL in the history of football. Unbelievable

Deleted comments.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/24/2010 09:49PM by DolfanMike.

You had to "edit" that post 4 hours after you put it up.....really?! lol

Edited 34 time(s). Last edit at 06/24/2010 09:57PM by DolfanMike.

MikeO Wrote:
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> And won't acknowledge that Tom
> Coughlin was a college coach that jumped to the
> NFL and was succesful then I don't know what to
> tell ya.


Tom Coughlin was an NFL assistant for 10 years before going to BC as a HC for 3 years. Yea, he coached in college, but he was hardly a career college coach. I understand if you have nothing to say to that.



>
> Switzer won. Period. Lots of coaches have taken
> over GREAT teams and lost with those GREAT teams.
> He won, can't knock him for that.
>

Your right. He did win. I give Switzer props for that.

A coach like Saban would have tried to put his stamp on that team right away and ruined a golden opportunity for a ring. Switzer understood that by doing very little he could win it all. But Barry seemed to have no clue as time went on.


> And if you are going to disqualify guys because
> they were pro assistants then became college head
> coaches before becoming NFL head coaches than your
> list of course starts and stops with Jimmy
> Johnson!!

Actually I am disqualifying guys because they were pro assistants for a long period before becoming college head coaches for a short time. I didn't disqualify Mooch because he was an NFL assistant for only a short time early in his career then became a college coach for a long time before going back to the pros.

So yea, my list college coaches that have done anything of note in the NFL is pretty much Mooch, Switzer, and Johnson.

In JJ's case, he lucked into a great trade and deep pocket owner in the pre-cap age. But he did build a serious winner, and should get props.

In Switzer's case he got handed the keys to a corvette and just was smart enough not to crash it. But he's hardly considered one of the best coaches in NFL history.

In Mooch's case, he didn't do much but bring a good team to a few playoff games.



> He's the only one (or one of like 3
> guys) that fits that insane narrow minded criteria
> in NFL history probably.
>

LOL! You are hysterical sometimes. Really, anyone that doesn't agree with you is insane!?! What are you, Mother Russia?



> By your logic Paterno and Bryant can't coach.

I never said that. You shouldn't be so sensitive. Really.


> And JJ is the only college coach who
> was "good" enough to jump to the NFL in the
> history of football.

No, JJ was smart enough to lane in a good situation. And I'm not talking the whole history, just the last 50 years or so.

Hey, its all good man.