Not good news for this holiday weekend, and not directly related to the Miami Dolphins, but apparently McNair was shot to death. This is just horrible. The guy recently ended an honorable career in the NFL and now meets a violent death instead of enjoying his retirement from sports.

He was a tough guy on the field, often playing injured and came very close to winning it all. I was hoping he would go into broadcasting because I'd have liked to see his perspective on today's players (as McNair was such a tough competitor).

RIP Air McNair.

Lots of celebrities have passed away just recently. I was saddened to hear about McNair. I wonder what will come out about this one.

it was a murder-sucicide.

The 20-year old girl shot McNair a bunch of times. Then she shot herself in the head and took her own life.


This girl McNair was cheating on his wife with had a few run ins with the law including one a couple days ago.

NOT a good time to be a celebrity.

I am actually tired of hearing what a "great person" Steve McNair was. He was an adulterer. He cheated on his wife and paid the ultimate price for it.

The same goes for Michael Jackson. The guy was a pedophile.

For some reason, we treat celebrities like they can do no wrong. I, for one, think we should hold them to a higher standard. Screw them both.

Jonathan Twilley Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am actually tired of hearing what a "great
> person" Steve McNair was. He was an adulterer.
> He cheated on his wife and paid the ultimate price
> for it.
>
> The same goes for Michael Jackson. The guy was a
> pedophile.
>
> For some reason, we treat celebrities like they
> can do no wrong. I, for one, think we should hold
> them to a higher standard. Screw them both.

Nough said!

Who are you guys to judge?

Marriage is a cruel joke played on men, who, biologically, want to hump everything in sight.

That aside, no life mistake is justified by death. NONE. Sometimes people make mistakes. Athletes are people. Celebrities are people. Just because we constantly hold a magnifying glass to everything they do does not change this fact.

I agree with you futt. Who the heck are we to judge, we all make mistakes everyday.

People make mistakes, that's life. Doesn't mean he had to be killed for cheating, dude are you kidding me?? Think about it. Micheal Jackson deserves to die also, are you joking man??? You're sick Twilley and whatever other moron that agrees with your ridiculous comments... Nobody knows what really went on to either of them in their personal lives, we only know what we see or hear but don't say that stupidity when you don't even know yourself. Let me guess you've been a good boy your whole life, Mr. Perfect right! sure buddy.

RIP both of them...

On a better note, GO FINS!!!!!

First off, I never said either one of them deserved to die for what they have done. I simply pointed out that I am tired of hearing about what a great person Steve McNair was. That's it. He wasn't a great person. A great man is faithful to his wife and kids. What he did was not a mistake. It was a conscious choice on his part and, unfortunately, it cost him dearly. My question is did he ever considered the other ramifications for cheating on his wife and kids? What he was doing reflects very poor character and selfishness. A great player he was, but don't call an adulterer a great person. I feel for his family. His affair was going to ultimately hurt them and it did so worse than anyone could have imagined.

As for Michael Jackson, I didn't say he deserved to die either. I consider myself a fan of his music. However, I wonder if he was perverted in some ways. It sure seemed like he was a pedophile, but I suppose he could be a man who innocently loved children and ignorantly allowed them to share a bed with him. I don't know if we will ever no the truth. I sure don't trust Al Sharpton's opinion. Regarless, I am very sorry for his kids and was incredibly saddened to hear of his passing and was especially touched by his daughter's words.

Just don't tell me that someone who would do those kind of things is a great guy. They are not.

I am not perfect and have made some mistakes and poor choices in my life. However, I can honestly say that I would never cheat if I had a wife and kids and I wouldn't ever molest a child. To me those choices are as low as they get. They are not to be forgiven. I am not sure how that makes me sick.

mcnair's wife apparently had no idea anything was going on and there was no talk of divorce.

also, have you ever read any of the affidavits or transcripts in the jackson case? smokinggun.com has a lot of it. it is really detailed and I find it very very hard to believe it was all made up. something fishy was going on there.

I don't get your comment about the DA thinking he would pay a lot of money. the first settlement was of a civil suit. the second case was a criminal proceeding. the state does not recover money in either one.

J Twilley said

" However, I can honestly say that I would never cheat if I had a wife and kids "

It is easy and foolish to say what you would never do while you are not in the position. A lot of great people have character flaws. I do not condone adultry but at this point in my life I have seen enough of my friends go thru some tough times in their lives and marriages and as they say it happens. McNair was a great person imho.

God judges not men.

The bottom line is that we don't know the whole story.

We never do.

And what defines a "good man"?

What if you work weekly at a soup kitchen, sponsor children in Africa, donate your clothes to the Salvation Army, don't cheat on your wife, play with your kids, save up for their college, but have an alcohol problem and get a DUI.

Is that a good person, or a bad one?

What if you are a blackmailing, lying, scamming, crook, but never cheated on your wife or taxes?

Good or bad?


The point is that "good" and "bad" doesn't have a line dividing the two. It's a spectrum.

If you don't agree that it is a spectrum, then if you have EVER made a mistake in your ENTIRE LIFE then you fall on the "bad" side with the rest of us because nobody is perfect, and if you want to make this issue black and white, then being "perfect" is the only way to fall on the "good" side.

To me a good person and friend is one I can trust. If you can't trust your own spouse, then you don't have a good spouse. You sound like one of my students that often proclaim "I wasn't the only one." The fact that so many people are that immoral does not make adultery okay. It is all about trust. While I have never been married, I have never cheated on a girlfriend and, as a teacher, people can trust me with their children. By the way, do you still think I am sick or a moron?

Right. To you, that's it. To me it is different. Same for everybody else here.

To each his own, and let's not judge others, is what I am aiming for here.

Holy crap! She shot him once in each temple and twice in the chest. What a psycho!

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

TheFutt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Right. To you, that's it. To me it is different.
> Same for everybody else here.
>
> To each his own, and let's not judge others, is
> what I am aiming for here.

What's different to you?

eesti Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Holy crap! She shot him once in each temple and
> twice in the chest. What a psycho!


at least the poor bastard was sleeping when she shot him, so he probably never felt a thing.

Michael Jackson was no Elvis. I've never been a fan of MJ. His voice was electronically modified and the only good music he made was written and performed by Quincy Jones. His dance moves, while practiced, were hardly original. Don't know if he's a pedophile or not, but he certainly seems to get accused of it a lot. Seemed wacked out on drugs. Threw a lot of money away. Hung "his" child over a fourth floor balcony window while wacked out on drugs. He never deserved the attention he got, and now that car wreck is over, hopefully people will move on with their lives.


Thankfully, I've never seen a football player, not even Ricky Williams, act like Michael Jackson.

ghotirule Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> > J Twilley said
>
> " However, I can honestly say that I would never
> cheat if I had a wife and kids "
>
> It is easy and foolish to say what you would never
> do while you are not in the position.
>
> Yea, that is sort of classic judgmental BS.
>
> Really, if you are the kind of person that can't
> even commit to a long term relationship and build
> a family, then you shouldn't talk.

Sure it is easy to say, but it is not foolish. I know, if put in the position, what I would do. I could be trusted because that is the type of person I am. While I have never been married, I have certainly had girlfriends and I never cheated. If I were married and had children, having taken a vow would mean something to me. Perhaps some of you aren't to be trusted and want to convince yourself that you are a good husband or father, but in my book, if you commit adultery, you are selfish and care more about satisfying your id than you care about your family. The oath is supposed to mean something afterall. It may be socially acceptable to you, but it doesn't make it right. To me it is the moral equivalent of spousal abuse.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/18/2009 09:58AM by Jonathan Twilley.

Jonathan Twilley Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ghotirule Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > > J Twilley said
> >
> > " However, I can honestly say that I would
> never
> > cheat if I had a wife and kids "
> >
> > It is easy and foolish to say what you would
> never
> > do while you are not in the position.
> >
> > Yea, that is sort of classic judgmental BS.
> >
> > Really, if you are the kind of person that
> can't
> > even commit to a long term relationship and
> build
> > a family, then you shouldn't talk.
>
> Sure it is easy to say, but it is not foolish. I
> know, if put in the position, what I would do. I
> could be trusted because that is the type of
> person I am. While I have never been married, I
> have certainly had girlfriends and I never
> cheated. If I were married and had children,
> having taken a vow would mean something to me.
> Perhaps some of you aren't to be trusted and want
> to convince yourself that you are a good husband
> or father, but in my book, if you commit adultery,
> you are selfish and care more about satisfying
> your id than you care about your family. The oath
> is supposed to mean something afterall. It may be
> socially acceptable to you, but it doesn't make it
> right. To me it is the moral equivalent of
> spousal abuse.

Nothing here to make me think you aren't some judgmental jerl detached from the reality of married life. I'm personally not the cheating type, but I know better than to judge.

You've had girlfiends? Why didn't you get married? If you didn't like them, why did you go out with them in the first place? Or was it that you weren't enough of a man to make the commitment?

And spousal abuse? What a joke. This is the kind of comment that makes it clear you know nothing of what you are talking about.

Okay you win. I am wrong. Cheating on your wife is perfectly okay. It is the man thing to do. We are biologically predisposed to doing it. Nothing bad ever happens when infidelity is exposed. Nobody was ever hurt by such a trivial thing and nobody has ever been killed over it. The children aren't in the least bit affected either. Most of them like having their family split up. It is simply a victimless crime so why should it just matter. It is just sex afterall. In fact, the whole marriage thing is a sham anyway. You truly are the one who knows what he is talking about. Sorry I ever questioned your wisdom.

With a 20 year old woman, man stupid, you beat it up and leave it your rich famous, he was stupid for doing what he did, im sorry for his kids, i hate the stupid girl for being stupid, but i blame her parents!! and i hope the guy who sold the gun gets some time. may her soul burn in hell. and may steve have a heavenly chat with god.

I'm probably in the minority here, but I don't look down much at McNair for having an affair. Since I got really into studying Evolutionary Psychology lately, I've come to consider "romantic love" to be pretty much a joke, and I've realized that human beings are - in essence - what the evolutionary psychologists / evolutionary biologists would call a "mostly monogamous" species. That is, both sexes actually have adaptations that lead to behavior that involves cheating on their long-term partners, as an optimal strategy for ensuring that their genes are carried forward to future generations.

Now in theory we have free-will and are not just slaves to our genetics, and a promise / vow is a promise / vow... but once you really start looking at the science behind mating strategies and the evolutionary basis for it, marriage starts to look like less of a big deal. Or at least that's what I've gotten from it all...

This coming from somebody who used to consider himself a "hopeless romantic," for what it's worth.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/21/2009 06:51PM by Doctor Feelgood.

Sounds like you had your heart broken, by a cheating women. I bet your a non athletic guy, who is a geek at heart, and have a small... But dont take that into being a negative thing, just means you got to work harder at making your body into a more wantable being, and its cool to be a geek, as long as you have a decent body!!! and face. Basicaly dont try so hard, have fun,get into shape, and youll find your love.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/22/2009 06:44AM by MiamiThunder.

I agree with the good Doctor. Marriage is not something that makes sense with the way our brains are wired. It's something that REALLY takes effort.

Couple that with the ease of getting a divorce these days and well...it just doesn't make sense.

It would take a truly special woman for me to even consider marriage. And I would ONLY marry if I was going to have children.

Life for us married people is different than others....

Don't you just wish you could fornicate at will like cat and dogs.

Just wait until my wife goes on a bussiness trip with my kids and her mom......

ITSSSSSSSSSSSS ON.......