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          Interesting take on CB position
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Interesting take on CB position
Posted by: tsstamper ()
Date: June 08, 2020 11:59PM

Overthecap is one of the sites I think provides good information and analysis. They've evolved beyond reporting purely financial/contract information to linking it with performance which I've found helpful.

At any rate, a last Fall, they had a piece on how the CB pay scale had essentially stagnated relative to the growth in the cap overall. This month they had an article regarding whether teams should spend more on the CB position and it sort of went into the value of the position and roster construction and, ultimately, this idea of building a position "supergroup" and how a team might go about doing it with the highest chances for successfully achieving it.

I've long believed that in the era of the salary cap and passer-friendly rules, consistent success as it relates to roster construction has become a function of:
(a) having a QB that is at least upper 1/2 year in & year out
(b) having a particular advantageous distinctive and leveraging the heck out of it
(c) not having massive unit weaknesses that can easily be exploited
(d) team-first culture fits from top to bottom.

While I'm not saying the Patriot way is the only way, I think it's inarguable that they're a blueprint for doing it the Dolphin way. And, I believe that they built a high-performing defense with CB being the foundational unit. I can't remember where I read, but they seem to play man more often than most...bringing in talented (and costly) CBs to do that simple job with excellence...and attempt to leverage near shut-down of multiple receivers so that their less talented (but certainly well coached & schemed) front 7 can outplay their collective talent with the extra time given by secondary coverage.

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Re: Interesting take on CB position
Posted by: samsam3738 ()
Date: June 09, 2020 02:11AM

As far as the cbs....It is simple. It will all depend on if we can generate a dominating pass rush.

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Re: Interesting take on CB position
Posted by: tsstamper ()
Date: June 09, 2020 02:37AM

I've always thought that the pass rush/pass defense were symbiotically related and traditionally the notion has been that pass defenders benefit more from a good pass rush than vice versa. I think that Pats (at least over the past few seasons) have used coverage to benefit their pass rush more (i.e. somewhat flipped the script). I really think they squeezed more juice from their pass rush than the talent would indicate because of the CB play.

Perhaps the more interesting thing for me is the idea of resource allocation and building a distinctive advantage. If CB salaries have been kept relatively low (especially compared to pass rushers) then it incentivizes being an early adopter of building a distinctive advantage in that area.

In terms of having a distinctive (and relatively sustainable) advantage, a team gets an inordinate amount of benefit because their opponents have to focus - for one week only - on this particular thing and adjust from their "normal" gameplan. I'm likely out over my skis on this as I've never coached or anything, but that's my understanding. It was, per my understanding, what drove a lot of Baltimore's success...their leveraging the heck out of a distinctive advantage of Lamar's skillset and an offense tailored around it. I'm very curious if it will be a significant, sustainable or be more like the Wildcat.

In terms of the economics of it, I think of the allocation of resources to building a particular distinctive advantage and it seems that building a proven young vet CB corps is more economical than building the same for pass rushers. Consequently, it allows for more resources to be used for other units. I.e. would you rather have, for instance, an elite CB unit and a very good OL or an elite pass rush unit and a below average OL (or whatever...there are so many permutations).

I think we'll get a bit of "cake & eat it too" with a significantly improved pass rush built on the foundation of an elite CB unit. Looking fwd to seeing how things play out.

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Re: Interesting take on CB position
Posted by: mizzou15 ()
Date: June 09, 2020 02:48AM

I think we are going about it the right way in our d-backfield. We actually having 4 corners in each position Rowe and McCain are converted corners playing safety. That shows man coverage will be big in our D. Needham and Perry, I liked as rookies and am looking forward to seeing more from these 2. Add the rookies Ibi and Jones along w/ vets Parker, Fejedelem and Colbert we are good at db. I think Im missing a couple of guys who will be on some other nfl roster in 2020.

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Re: Interesting take on CB position
Posted by: tsstamper ()
Date: June 09, 2020 03:19AM

For all of my "performance meets economics" theorizing, I really just hope it's the 2nd coming of Madison, Surtain & crew. smiling smiley

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Re: Interesting take on CB position
Posted by: pafinfan ()
Date: June 09, 2020 05:37AM

I like tsstamper's "pass rush/pass defense were symbiotically related" statement.
How much did Zach Thomas, Jason Taylor benefit off of Madison & Surtain and vice versa?

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Re: Interesting take on CB position
Date: June 09, 2020 06:23AM

pafinfan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I like tsstamper's "pass rush/pass defense were
> symbiotically related" statement.
> How much did Zach Thomas, Jason Taylor benefit off
> of Madison & Surtain and vice versa?


That was everything. Madison and Surtain played man to man and shut it down leaving Zach Thomas to roam sideline to sideline. He was good enough to read every play and was a step closer and never missed a tackle.

JT was quick and always was in the QBs mind. Each had a job and JJ made sure they knew it .

Would love to see that kind of defensive play again. IMO defense wins games. In 19 yrs Marino never had a great defense. In recent yrs we fall apart in the 4th Qtr.

I love the additions to our backfield. But none of it will amount to much if the rest, MLB and DE dont do thier jobs as well. I really like Flores approach , I think he gets it.

GO MIAMI!!!

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Re: Interesting take on CB position
Posted by: samsam3738 ()
Date: June 09, 2020 06:49AM

Madison and surtain were great but a lot of their great play had to do with JT and zachs pass rush thats for sure...nowdays with the likes of dion jordan and the great pass rushers weve had in the last 15 years madison and surtain wont be as effective.

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