Just read a report that said Miami told people at combine they may tag OV and trade to the NYG.

This would be awesome IMO (and probably too good to be true).

Franchise tag calls for 2 first round picks but we could settle for less.

Imagine having the #8 AND #10 pick this year and walking away with two top 10 players.

A 25 year player in his prime trade.....Good job miami....


Thats why we keep stinking year after year.

samsam3738 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A 25 year player in his prime trade.....Good job
> miami....
>
>
> Thats why we keep stinking year after year.


As opposed to letting him walk away and get nothing in return......or overpaying by a lot to keep him

Resign him and keep him....


No sense in grooming all these players and them letting them go to other teams. Especially players as good as OV.


I repeat....thats why we keep getting worse and worse.....


We let go of players and the ones that we sign to replace them are worse.

I'm all for keeping as well, just not sure the 15 million (or more) it might take to keep him will be worth it.

The FO already screwed up by not signing OV last year when they could have gotten him for MUCH less. Probably less than 10 mil.

Now they have to cut their losses and move on if he insists on a huge deal.

getting 2 first round picks or even just 1 (being #10) allows you to draft a player on the cheap for the next 5 years and also allows you more room to sign much needed FA's.

We can't afford to keep overspending or we will be in the same shape as Buffalo with the cap.

We don't even know what the market is going to be for OV. What will teams offer him? I doubt it approaches 15 mil to make him the highest paid DE in the NFL. He is certainly not the best DE or even in the top 10. Let teams like Buffalo overspend for unrealized potential.

Signing OV to a contract like that would give us 3 DE's with top 15 salaries.

Getting a 1st round pick for OV would be a miracle.

JoeFootball Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The FO already screwed up by not signing OV last
> year when they could have gotten him for MUCH
> less. Probably less than 10 mil.
>
> Now they have to cut their losses and move on if
> he insists on a huge deal.
>
> getting 2 first round picks or even just 1 (being
> #10) allows you to draft a player on the cheap for
> the next 5 years and also allows you more room to
> sign much needed FA's.
>
> We can't afford to keep overspending or we will be
> in the same shape as Buffalo with the cap.
>
> We don't even know what the market is going to be
> for OV. What will teams offer him? I doubt it
> approaches 15 mil to make him the highest paid DE
> in the NFL. He is certainly not the best DE or
> even in the top 10. Let teams like Buffalo
> overspend for unrealized potential.
>
> Signing OV to a contract like that would give us 3
> DE's with top 15 salaries.
>
> Getting a 1st round pick for OV would be a
> miracle.

*******************************************************

Agreed, Joe.

Highly unlikely anyone would take on OV's $15M salary. A team could, but doubtful.

Would a team give up two number one's? Don't think so. As you said, Miami would be lucky to get one.

However, if Miami was guaranteed that they could get a number one pick and possibly something else, then go ahead.

If a team is loaded but needed that one pass rusher to get them to the Super Bowl, then I could see them trading for OV, but...doubtful Miami will resign him for that big of a price tag and OV is going to hit the market anyway.

Miami can't keep paying these big contracts and remaining 8-8 or worse.

I would like for Miami to keep him, but not at his (soon) asking price.

And to SamSam, I hear ya about Miami letting their best players go, but in this case, Miami has no choice. As has been said on numerous occasions on this board, Miami screwed up by not signing him earlier when they could have gotten him for a lot less.

The Giants nbr 10 spot for Vernon is almost unthinkable. I hope the front office pulls it off. Picks 8 & 10, signing Laurinaitis and having the big DE we just signed from the CFL panning out would go a long way to getting us on the right road.

Wow. Abraham is taking some liberties with that statement. "Top FA in the league"?

Not Von Miller, Josh Norman, Mo Wilkerson or Eric Berry?

What if Miami can get 2nd round pick for OV would it be worth it?

dgoodhue Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What if Miami can get 2nd round pick for OV would
> it be worth it?

If they have no intention of keeping him, yes.

The going rate is 2 1sts so I bet we could get a 2nd and 3rd this year or 2 2nds.

I can see the Giants coming to their senses and giving up 2 2nds rather than the nbr 10.

A week from Sunday (Mar 6) teams can start negotiating with agents.

In order for a trade to happen, OV would have to agree to a long term deal so any potential team (as well as Miami) will have an idea this week of what type of contract OV is seeking. That will determine the outcome.

Personally I don't see any team giving up a (top half) 1st round pick AND 13-14 mil a year for Vernon.

The last player Miami tagged was Randy Starks (8.45 mil) in 2013 and Paul Soliai in 2011 (12.5 mil). I believe the tag was inflated that year due to the Albert Haynseworth deal.

Hopefully, OV and David Canter come back down to earth after this week.

The franchise tag deadline is March 1st (next Tuesday).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2016 05:26AM by JoeFootball.

I'll say again that the team was in such disarray last year that it is difficult to evaluate any player accurately.

That said, OV is good. But I can't overlook:
- his performance rose dramatically in the 2nd half of his contract year
- stupid penalties
- playing on the same line with Wake and Suh didn't do that much to improve his results. I know that Wake didn't play much, but in the short time he was healthy, he was on an absolute terror

Not specific to OV, we need to be able to use 10-15 mill differently, IMO. He's lucky and we're unlucky that he's the best DE in this FA class...like Mike Wallace a few years ago.

My approach would be to sign Shelby and make DE a draft priority (not necessarily #1, but priority). If I could get a 1st-rounder, I do it.

So the plan would be to trade Vernon and then use the 10th overall pick to draft his replacement?

Or is the plan to trade Vernon and then just have a huge hole at DE? Because Shelby sucks. He's a rotational player. He's depth. That's all he is. You really want to go into next season with Shelby as our starting RDE?

And its not like we could package the two picks to move up to fill a huge void on the team and allow for the hole at DE. There's no player worth trading the 8 & 10 pick for.

There's also no issue with paying Vernon, despite the fact our incompetent front office could have saved a couple mil per year had they signed him last season. Do you see how much the cap goes up every year? And who are we paying for now anyway? Suh, Tannehill, Pouncey, Albert? Throw in Jones and Cameron if you'd like. Still.. Only a handful of guys. Other positions are filled by guys in their rookie deals or guys that suck and need to be replaced anyway.

mizzou15 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Giants nbr 10 spot for Vernon is almost
> unthinkable. I hope the front office pulls it off.
> Picks 8 & 10, signing Laurinaitis and having the
> big DE we just signed from the CFL panning out
> would go a long way to getting us on the right
> road.

*****************************************************

Highly doubt any of that will happen.

Yep but we did get lucky going the CFL route once w/ Wake hope this guy pans out. The Vernon to the Giants thing is to good to be true.

At the end of the day, I just don't think he's worth top FA DE money given where our team is. I think we would be paying him "best" money when he is just "best available". I think the Mike Wallace comparison is appropriate. Mike didn't do terribly for us or anything, but he was never mistaken for one of the best, though we paid him like he was.

If I had #8 and #10, I'd likely try to use one of them on a DE but I haven't studied the draft a ton so don't know what's really available there.

8 & 10 you could go OL and DL, LB or CB


2 of Stanley , Hargreaves, Spence, Ogbah, Buckner, Lawson, Jack, Ragland

Stanley, Spence or Hargreaves and Su'a Cravens in the second would be killer

We already screwed up by not extending Vernon last year. I don't think we should compound the problem by vastly overpaying him.


This team has holes everywhere. Why not use that 15.7 in cap space and get 3 - 4 players.

Yeah use that 15.7 in cap space on scrubs...


Like we always do.

or we could tie it to one guy and still be riddled with holes everywhere else.

A few things to keep in mind...

*The salary cap has gone up 34 mil over the past three years. Salaries are going to be higher.

*The free agent market for 4-3 DE's is VERY slim. Chris Long, JPP, Jason Jones, Greg Hardy, Robert Ayers, Adrian Clayborn, Kroy Biermann are the top names and maybe two are weak side guys.

*The draft is VERY weak for weak side 4-3 DE's and that's not an easy position to fill, even for the most talented rookies. You have Shaq Lawson, Noah Spence, Emmanuel Ogbah, Shilique Calhoun, Leonard Floyd, Josh Perry, Kyler Fackrell, Jordan Jenkins & Kamalei Correa who should all be gone by the end of round 2.

*We also need a strong side DE.

*16 defensive linemen had 10 sacks or more last year. 6 were 4-3 DE's, 3 were 3-4 DE's, 3 were DT's and 4 were 3-4 OLB's.

*The market for OV could consist of 3-4 and 4-3 teams like Arizona, Buffalo, NYJ, Cleveland, Indy, KC, Oakland, SD, Dallas, NYG, Detroit, Minnesota, Atlanta, Carolina, NOLA, Tampa, LA & SF.

Considering how much cap space we have wrapped up in Suh and Wake, trading OV in this scenario put forth by the OP would be a sensible and needed move due to cap issues. If we pay big to keep OV, we will have huge amounts of cap space tied to our front four, leaving a deficiency in other areas because we have to get low payed players in those spots.

Trading him is no longer an option since they put the transition tag on him, we do get the chance to match whatever contract he's offered though.

I think it is something like 60.8 mil (in 2016) we have wrapped up in our D-line between Jordan, Wake, OV, Suh and Mitchell. Funny thing is 4 of them could be gone this year and with a restructure, we drop that number to 10.5 million.

We need a redistribution of wealth.