Look at the situation in San Francisco for a good example of what coaching and schemes can do to contribute to a qb being successful or horrible. Harbaugh leaves and now CK looks horrible after having a season that earned him a huge contract.

This game is 99% mental. ALL are incredible athletes. Its the mental aspect that wins championships. Philbin is a loser. Not a leader. Huge mistake ever signing him. I've seen more emotions over a guy who just found out he didn't have any cavities after a dental exam. .

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

Offensive line only you say. Check out the rest. As I said in a recent post: Mediocrities are everywhere. Hope Ryan's mind goes fine with all that pathetic assistance he has to work with.

There are worse teams performing much better. This team has a lot of wins in them. I haven't given up on this season yet. We are only 1/4 of the way done. Lots of football left to play. Lots of time to fix issues and right the ship. Firing the coach and putting in a new system is the right call.

FootballGod Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There are worse teams performing much better. This
> team has a lot of wins in them. I haven't given up
> on this season yet. We are only 1/4 of the way
> done. Lots of football left to play. Lots of time
> to fix issues and right the ship. Firing the coach
> and putting in a new system is the right call.



I'll admit I did kinda give up......But today was the right decision and Ross is short on those! I'm feelin better might even wear a Dolphins shirt again for a change!!

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

Miami is allowing 165 yards per game running. That is the worst in the NFL. After sinking 60 mill guaranteed in Suh, Ross couldn't just let that fly. Campbell, for better or worse, is a part of the parcells coaching tree. I foresee a return to smashmouth and a commitment to the run.

Since this thread is about the QB. See some here don't like RT. But I say the following. The day he works with solid OL's and have copies of
Emmitt Smith, Barry Sanders, Jerry Rice, Michael Irvin or other facsimiles. If the fact becomes that he does not perform to accordance with that competent assistance. I will be the first here to say that he sucks.

I think Chren B was right all along...on tannehill

samsam3738 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> TO CHREN B....
>
> Watch tannehill go to another team and become a
> superstar in the run and shoot.....Where here
> philbin insisted on keeping him in the pocket and
> for him to become a pocket qb...
>
> Gotta put the players in a position to succeed.
> Play to their strenghs. And coaches here cant see
> that.....Thats why philbin is gone and many more
> coach cuts on the way i assure you.

Agreed. I wonder if you would have swapped Marino and Montana years ago if EITHER would have been very successful in the other's system.

I would LOVE to see Tannehill in the run and shoot or something similar! That said, it shouldn't take long to see if he's got anything left to show in that or ANY other system!

What we DON'T need is another 3 years worth of excuses because "he's in a new system", blah, blah, blah, "his<insert any part of the team here> sucks", yap, yap, yap, "the coaching stinks", woka, woka, woka... I'm tired of 15 years of excuses when it comes to QB play on this team.

Tannehill is now a 4 year NFL starter. He's is yet to make a difference or show much of anything in the way of leadership or results. Running up yardage and TD's when the game is over and it doesn't matter is NOT results. I KNOW, I KNOW there are a FEW notable exceptions but for the most part a franchise level QB shows it pretty quickly, even on poor teams.

Flame away, you can't argue with results (or lack of them)...

OCphin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm sorry, but Tannehill is horrible for a
> starting NFL QB. He might make an average back up,
> but that;s about it.
>
> 90% of his game is lacking. He does not possess
> necessary QB DNA that is an absolute requisite for
> the position.
> Accuracy is and has been a constant issue.
>
> In the words of Mike Singleton "Can't win with
> em!..."
>
> Stung again by Ireland. Could of had

******************************************************

Disagree, OCphin.

Tanneyhill is a good QB.

Getting rid of him, as you are (supposedly) suggesting....is there another Marino out there? I don't think so. Is there a Marino in the college ranks that will be in the draft next year? I don't think so.

RT has shown he can be the guy. Granted, he (so far) is not a HOFer, but he has done just fine since being drafted. He had a poor game vs the Jets...hell, what player on the Fins didn't? Even Landry dropped a couple of passes.

Can't judge any of the players from what happened Sunday (or even vs Buffalo).

Let's hope Campbell knows what is going on with this team and can fix it, then we will see what the Miami Dolphins is really all about.

colonel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> When the QB gets pounded regularly, gun shyness
> sets in. Movement becomes erratic, throws off
> balance and the thought process and confidence
> level goes out the window. O-line is making his
> life and ability to play fairly well impossible.
>
>
> (Down deep, I don't see him leading the team to a
> divisional championship even with a solid
> o-line--he's not good enough.)

******************************************************

Colonel, I agree, then disagree.

Having no OL does shake up any QB. Everything you said is correct.

Disagree in that I believe he CAN lead this team to a championship. RT is in the same mold as Griese, except in the area of Field General. Bob had that gift, moreso than the majority of QBs that have played in the NFL. The great Johnny Unitas, when asked what QB he thought was great, picked Griese over Namath, specifically because of his mind.

Get this team playing the way they should be playing, and RT will be just fine.

Now, if another Marino came along.....

Well, again, the Dolphins pass protection is ranked 18th...and our QB is ranked 30th...It's not all on the offensive line.

Tannehill has taken a beating this year. The defense has been letting up scores on the first couple possessions, so the offense is almost always playing catch up after the first series.

I've already stated my opinion of whether Tannehill will EVER be a good POCKET QB.

I think he can be a good QB, not just a good pocket QB. Maybe it's the poor oline that has got him gun shy. Maybe with an o line that allows him to take time, he will be all that his supporters expect out of him.

I suspect, however, being a pocket QB is not within his natural talents.

It would be a shame if we give up on him and trade him and then he terrorizes the NFL with his God given talents which we stubbornly refuse to utilize.

KB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Tannehill doesn't show the instincts, consistency
> or competitive fire to be a franchise level QB.
> The o line isn't great but that doesn't make
> Tannehill good. He has 2.whatever seconds to get
> rid of the ball? So what? Brady and Manning have
> similar figures. Don't care what kind of line you
> have you aren't gonna get 4-5 seconds to throw the
> ball against an NFL pass rush. You just aren't.
> If he's being used wrong he should step up and say
> something...he's a fourth year guy now not a
> rookie. That's part of being a leader which the
> QB is. There are multiple problems on this team
> but I just can't believe we are as talent poor as
> we look. IMO a lot has to do with the team having
> no confidence in their leadership and that
> includes the QB.

*********************************************************

KB. As I've said before, RT is a good QB. If Campbell can get this team straightened out and playing up to their skill level, you will see a much better QB. Look at RT's previous years...he has improved in everything, and yes, even the deep ball. True, he is still missing, but it is coming around.

How can anyone judge any Fins player on what is going on this year? The whole team stinks. It is definitely not because of a lack of talent. Even the OL has talent, but for some reason, just is not being displayed. We have poor guard play, that's a given. They are professionals; if they play to a professional level, the line play will improve. I can't begin to tell anyone what the real problem is, as I am not part of the organization. The OL has to be upgraded (talent) that is not a question. But, in the meantime, the coaches should be doing something to improve their play. Maybe with Campbell running the ship, things can improve.

RT, quite often, doesn't even have 2 seconds to do anything - pass or hand off. He was buried a few times just trying to hand off. That's on him? I would like to see anyone on this board play QB with a line that can't run nor pass block, and having a mind that is telling you that you are going to be crushed in another split second, and you can be back there nice and calm? Show me.

Now, I will agree with you in that RT needs to step up and say something....about a lot of things. The one thing I wish for him to do is to get fired up and start getting on some of his team mates. I don't know if he has done that or not, but watching the games on TV, I haven't seen it. It may not be in his nature to do that, but he does have to show some fire.

To answer your question...no, this team is not talent-poor. There is a lot of talent on this team, and it is spread throughout, just not enough in the right spots. Hate to say it, as it is routine, but hopefully next year we will go after needed talent to shore up the weaknesses.

The team, IMO, does not have a problem with RT. QB is not one of the weaknesses, despite what some of you believe.

I think it's both, Cap. Sometimes Tanny does not have time to take a second breath but sometimes his receivers are running "butt naked" as we used to say in the 50's and 60's and he still misses them. I've seen fewer drops than last year but I have seen a few time when I thought it was the receiver's fault. So there's everything really.

captkoi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> KB Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Tannehill doesn't show the instincts,
> consistency
> > or competitive fire to be a franchise level QB.
>
> > The o line isn't great but that doesn't make
> > Tannehill good. He has 2.whatever seconds to
> get
> > rid of the ball? So what? Brady and Manning
> have
> > similar figures. Don't care what kind of line
> you
> > have you aren't gonna get 4-5 seconds to throw
> the
> > ball against an NFL pass rush. You just aren't.
>
> > If he's being used wrong he should step up and
> say
> > something...he's a fourth year guy now not a
> > rookie. That's part of being a leader which
> the
> > QB is. There are multiple problems on this
> team
> > but I just can't believe we are as talent poor
> as
> > we look. IMO a lot has to do with the team
> having
> > no confidence in their leadership and that
> > includes the QB.
>
> **************************************************
> *******
>
> KB. As I've said before, RT is a good QB. If
> Campbell can get this team straightened out and
> playing up to their skill level, you will see a
> much better QB. Look at RT's previous years...he
> has improved in everything, and yes, even the deep
> ball. True, he is still missing, but it is coming
> around.
>
> How can anyone judge any Fins player on what is
> going on this year? The whole team stinks. It is
> definitely not because of a lack of talent. Even
> the OL has talent, but for some reason, just is
> not being displayed. We have poor guard play,
> that's a given. They are professionals; if they
> play to a professional level, the line play will
> improve. I can't begin to tell anyone what the
> real problem is, as I am not part of the
> organization. The OL has to be upgraded (talent)
> that is not a question. But, in the meantime, the
> coaches should be doing something to improve their
> play. Maybe with Campbell running the ship, things
> can improve.
>
> RT, quite often, doesn't even have 2 seconds to do
> anything - pass or hand off. He was buried a few
> times just trying to hand off. That's on him? I
> would like to see anyone on this board play QB
> with a line that can't run nor pass block, and
> having a mind that is telling you that you are
> going to be crushed in another split second, and
> you can be back there nice and calm? Show me.
>
> Now, I will agree with you in that RT needs to
> step up and say something....about a lot of
> things. The one thing I wish for him to do is to
> get fired up and start getting on some of his team
> mates. I don't know if he has done that or not,
> but watching the games on TV, I haven't seen it.
> It may not be in his nature to do that, but he
> does have to show some fire.
>
> To answer your question...no, this team is not
> talent-poor. There is a lot of talent on this
> team, and it is spread throughout, just not enough
> in the right spots. Hate to say it, as it is
> routine, but hopefully next year we will go after
> needed talent to shore up the weaknesses.
>
> The team, IMO, does not have a problem with RT. QB
> is not one of the weaknesses, despite what some of
> you believe.

Well cap If you 'Can't tell me what the problem is' HOW are you so sure it ISN'T the QB? I hope you're right. I hope Campbell IMMEDIATELY goes away from the offensive system we are currently TRYING to run and Tannehill looks all world.

Thats yet to be seen, but I've seen enough to be of the opinion that he is just NOT comfortable in the pocket even when he DOES have protection NOR does he have the accuracy past 15-20 yards to regularly stretch the field with the passing game. And that is two strikes against an NFL QB.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/05/2015 12:28PM by KB.

just exactly HOW MANY MORE YEARS do we have to wait to judge Tannehill????

ohhhhh, right.... until he has the perfect number of weapons and the perfect offensive line?

if we are going to have to wait until he has......

"copies of Emmitt Smith, Barry Sanders, Jerry Rice, Michael Irvin or other facsimiles"

....then we will be waiting and waiting

very few if any teams have that in today's NFL

It's been four years. Tannehill has not won one playoff game.

I hope a new coach realizes what the rest of the league realized last year: Tannehill is just not that good. End of story.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/05/2015 12:50PM by sickofit.

sickofit Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> just exactly HOW MANY MORE YEARS do we have to
> wait to judge Tannehill????
>
> ohhhhh, right.... until he has the perfect number
> of weapons and the perfect offensive line?
>
> if we are going to have to wait until he
> has......
>
> "copies of Emmitt Smith, Barry Sanders, Jerry
> Rice, Michael Irvin or other facsimiles"
>
> ....then we will be waiting and waiting
>
> very few if any teams have that in today's NFL
>
> It's been four years. Tannehill has not won one
> playoff game.
>
> I hope a new coach realizes what the rest of the
> league realized last year: Tannehill is just not
> that good. End of story.

My opinion also. To those who say 'Elite' QB's are rare, I say "Elite Teams" who are successful with average QB's are even rarer.

So while were throwing out the baby with the bathwater, who exactly is out there on the free agent market that we could immediately plug in and expect greatness from? Phillip Sims? Rex Grossman? Cody Fajardo???

The answer is there is no one in free agency or the current college draft class that would be a step up from RT.

We have the weapons to empower him, we just need to introduce a little stability and continuity to our offense and give him an environment to flourish rather than fail.

Before you point your finger at RT, whose numbers have been good until our recent meltdown, you better be pointing it at everyone else on the team that is failing right along with him this year.

This is what I think about this theory/thread....

RT is not doing bad as a QB for us. Some people want a perfect player and those are very rare. Is RT one of those, not quite but he is good enough given help.

There's no wonder he's struggling lately when you take into account;

1. O-Line that can't run or pass block well enough...non existent blitz pickups.
2. Him being under pressure from defenders almost immediately more often than not...leading to forced balls, off target balls and shaky confidence.
3. Receivers dropping balls.
4. Receivers not getting open.
5. Coaches instructing him to stay in the pocket and look for receivers coming open...eventually, vs him running as he has in past seasons.
6. Defense putting the offense in very deep holes at the opening gun.
7. Coaches that insist on calling plays that take more time to develop than the O-Line can provide.
8. Coaches because of multiple circumstances, abandoning the run game and when they do run the ball it's to the outside and our backs can't reach the corner.
9. Penalties, mistakes, poor routes, poor angles, poor tackles...etc.
10. D that can't stop, or even slow down ANYONE.

I'm sure I'm forgetting things here but, the sheer volume of these things makes it pretty much impossible for RT, or any QB for that matter, to overcome them.

I just hope that we (as in the coaches and front office) are not completely ruining RT and his chances for continued improvement.

sickofit Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> just exactly HOW MANY MORE YEARS do we have to
> wait to judge Tannehill????
>
> ohhhhh, right.... until he has the perfect number
> of weapons and the perfect offensive line?
>
> if we are going to have to wait until he
> has......
>
> "copies of Emmitt Smith, Barry Sanders, Jerry
> Rice, Michael Irvin or other facsimiles"
>
> ....then we will be waiting and waiting
>
> very few if any teams have that in today's NFL
>
> It's been four years. Tannehill has not won one
> playoff game.
>
> I hope a new coach realizes what the rest of the
> league realized last year: Tannehill is just not
> that good. End of story.

****************************************************

OK, let's suppose you are right, sickofit. Who do you propose to bring in?

Just a technical disagreement, PhinsUp (great name), about this year's QB draft class, out here on the left Coast alone there are two great QB prospects, Cody Kessler, USC and Josh Rosen, UCLA. Not saying that's where we go but just defending the college crop.

We gotta live w/ Tannehill thru this season and next. His head is on the block too. There have been plays where the line held up, the receiver ran the right pattern, got open and the ball was just not there. We can drop him after 2016 if he has not improved. Bring in someone to challenge him next off season for sure if this current pattern continues.

exactly what mizzou said, we don't really have any other choice

OCphin,

There are a good number of TANN haters, or not hater but very convinced he does not have the where with all to be a starting QB in the NFL.

I disagree for one main reason:
1) I don't think he has ever felt confident & comfortable behind the starting lines he has had to endure.

One stretch of 10-games behind quality protectors & BLOCKERS(opening holes for runners opens WRs & TEs specially for catches)!

I know that is hypothetical BS. But I also feel if we trade him to a team that protects him, someday the NFL schedule makers will make a point(MNF) of scheduling his team in Miami & it won't be 5 catches & a TD like Charles Clay did. It will be 4 quarters of an accurate-protected-(fast runner if need be) QB wanting to show everyone how far he can complete a pass! He can do it!

KNick637

set aside the oline for a moment.

when down by 2 scores in the 2nd half who feels good about our chances? who feels good about our QB elevating his game to bring this team back. A QB that's going to hit a big pass to change the complexion of a game?

I sure don't.

No matter the other deficiencies you need your $94mm QB to rise above that and make a play. The IT factor. I don't think that's too much to ask.