Did the benching just make his decision to find a new home in the off season much easier? Imagine Bush and Lynch in Seattle

What was the purpose of benching the best playmaker on the team?

Bush = T.W.A.T(Too Worried About Tacklers)

He could only weaken Seattle's backfield, being the polar opposite of the way Lynch (and other good backs) runs.

I hate the way Bush runs. Scared and tentative. Never has, and never will work in the NFL. I'm good with cutting ties at the end of the year.
Lets go with Thomas and Miller in the future.

You tell me, GBO. He had two tacklers on him at least and they ripped the ball out of his hand.

It wasn't like he was holding it loose and it was punched out as he went by.

If he wanted to bench someone, he should have benched the guys who were in on the pass rush of Locker and let him fall completely on the ground (and I don't mean he just went down on one knee but he was lying flat on his back) and let him get up and run for about 20 to 30 yards. Amazing.

I think there's something going on with him and Reggie.

Tne most important aspect of both positions is the same protect the football, Yet funny how bush is benched for one turnover but Tannehill has 3 turnovers and never gets benched... Stupid move benching Bush, Bush is the type of players that could bounce back and want to make amends for his fumble by breaking one long.. Instead he gets to sit on the sidelines upset about that play so long it turns against him and he nevers does anything in the 2nd half.. Bad coaching IMO

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All things are subject to interpretation whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth.
Nietzsche



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/12/2012 01:55AM by Crowder52.

There is method to this madness. Philbin that is.

We only see that Bush was kept out of the game, and don't know the reasons for it. We can only surmise...guess on why that was done.

=====
My fan appreciation for Reggie Bush is slipping away. When he was with the Saints he was used sparingly. I'm beginning to see why. Bush is not a hard-nosed running back. He doesn't like to get hit (smart really if you thing about it). Yet, the game requires toughness running the A gaps. Bush appears to hate those calls as he dances rather than to hit the gaps hard. Bush is fooling himself if the thinks he can be an every down back. How many times can you run to the outside, or run a screen?

Lamar Miller is tougher than Bush and could very well become the back we need.

I suggest we use Bush as a WR in the slot and use him sparingly as a A gap runner. Once Bush gets the ball in the open field--he is electric. The bottom line--we aren't using him the right way all the time. Other teams know it too. Putting Bush in the slot requires the opposition to run 5 cbs or face a bad mismatch at LB. When that happens, the running game changes IMO.

Everyone is still blaming Bush.

Richie Incognito also stood on the sidelines for a long time following a personal foul.

Coach Philbin may just be trying to be a disciplinarian by trying to instill a dire need for execution and consistency. Incognito is a bully and needs to be reminded that he's not in charge. As for Bush, he is a playmaker but is not prized to the extent that he can't be sidelined for failing to execute. Dancing around, not hitting the gaps, and then finally making some up field headway just to have the ball ripped from his hands...yes, a message was delivered.

Considering the offensive line was playing like crap, Bush would not have won this game for us anyway.

They have been playing like crap for weeks!

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

Yeah Colonel but the only problem was that if Bush had fumbled while trying to dance, even if he had been blazing down the field and the ball had been tapped out of his arm while passing by, I would have agreed with benching him.

But I'll go back and look at the play if its one NFL highlights but as I remember he was in the hands of at least three defenders and one ripped the ball out of his arms while he was falling down, hardly something you can fault him with.

His size is his size. He is not built in the mode of the new running back nowadays who have his height but much more bulk. His body type was the prototypical body type of 10 years ago. Now, that Ballard of Indy is today's prototype running back. Not Reggie.

I totally agree with whoever says that he should be used more like Sparano used him and that is catching passes out of the backfield in open space.

Philbin is trying so hard to be the anti Sparano that he's going to find himself out of a job.

He had the ball ripped from him as he was falling backwards with both hands on the ball. He was about 6" off the ground when the ball was stripped. He has to hang on to the ball plain and simple. His weight has little to do with it. WR's have to hang on to the ball as well and they are always big. Bush has a set of guns. No reason he shouldn't hang on to that. Hey, Fumbles happen to the best of them but this was his 3rd lost fumble this year in 126 rushing attempts. That's a fumble every 42 rushes. Unacceptable.

Not to mention it changed the momentum of the entire game as they scored a TD in response....and it was all crap from there on out.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

Yeah but even accepting your own statement, he was not carrying the ball carelessly like Daniel Thomas was doing last years when all they had to do is "poke the ball out" as he passed by.

Bush is a smallish back, not a Javorskie Lane who can be expected to outwrestle two guys.

Plain and simple, you only criticize a guy when he carries the ball carelessly. If he is out-muscled, how can you criticize that?

Chyren-you surmise that it was only the lost ball that caused Philbin to temporarily take him out of the game. I suggest it was more than the ball being taken away from him. From our fan position it looks like he was taken out because of that lost ball...it may have been for other things, cumulative things...other missteps he made during recent games, practices and the like. We will never know. Same situation with Incognito. I don't believe it was just for the personal foul call during the game that caused Philbin to keep him on the sidelines. It's illogical...it has to be other things that have added up in Philbin's head. This is conjecture on my part. I do believe Philbin wants a disciplined team though.

The ball being stripped from Bush changed the momentum of the game. Sure. However, I'm not sure just how much momentum the Dolphins really had at that early point in the game. It was a set back but not one that could not be overcome.

You may be right but the thing you say, Colonel, that cannot be disputed is that we will probably never know.

Chyren, Colonel, except Philbin has already shown that when a player fumbles he yanks him, and minimizes his snaps... Bush also addressed it and refered to the fumble, (paraphrased) I didnt deserve to play, everybody knows the most important job of a RB is protecting the football... So I dont think anyone is taking some big giant leap of faith that, the fumble caused his benching.. I just think it was stupid..... Give a player a chance to bounce back and redeem himself.... As I said he is fine with Tannehill having three turnovers and not benching him.... Both QB and RB most important job requirements are protect the football... He holds Bush to one standard and RT to another it seems.. Taking inconsistent positions when in a position of power, not normally a good tactic to take IMO........

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All things are subject to interpretation whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth.
Nietzsche

Benching a player for three fumbles is a bush league move. I dont care how you spin it. If you don't like the way the guy runs, don't start him but don't substantiate your benching him because of a couple fumbles over a 9 game stretch. Ridiculous!

That projects to around 6 lost fumbles at the end of the year for one player. Is that acceptable?

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

GBOFinFan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Benching a player for three fumbles is a bush
> league move. I dont care how you spin it. If you
> don't like the way the guy runs, don't start him
> but don't substantiate your benching him because
> of a couple fumbles over a 9 game stretch.
> Ridiculous!


So your stance is that if you don't like the way a guy is producing don't play him?

And that differs from what philbin did how?

Look, this isn't that complicated. Talented players get chances to produce on the field after earning that chance in practice. Starting or coming off the bench is irrelevant. When a player messes up coaches will play guys that are messing up less either because it gives the team a better chance to win or because they are trying to get a players attention to make him focus better.

Bush has been playing like crap for a month. That fumble put a team with no margin for error behind the 8 ball right out of the gate.

He deserved to get benched.

So did incognito.

Philbin's got it right. He has to establish this philosophy from the beginning, he has to be consistent with it and it has to apply to everyone.

He can't suddenly start holding players accountable next year. Players need to be held accountable from the beginning.

Bush is the hardest worker on the team and a team leader. You do not bench him for that fumble.

Philpin is getting on my bad list.

Lamar Miller is a stud....

Bush will probably go to the Jets and dominate

dolphin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bush is the hardest worker on the team and a team
> leader. You do not bench him for that fumble.
>
> Philpin is getting on my bad list.
>
> Lamar Miller is a stud....
>
> Bush will probably go to the Jets and dominate


He's a team leader. That's PRECISELY why yo bench him when he has his head up his ass.

It sends the message to everyone that there is accountability and nobody is above the team.

People complain when coaches do nothing , and they complain when they show some balls and bench someone for reasons unknown to you or I. The Titans game was meaningless.I like the message sent too bad I doubt it was recieved though.

Bush is tied for second worst among RB's with 3 fumbles. (RG3 and Vick lead the league with 6)

Cedric Benson led the NFL (RB's) last year with 5 for the ENTIRE season.

Bush was tied for 2nd worst last year with 4.

(Matt Moore had 5).

This is not a new problem.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

ChyrenB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yeah but even accepting your own statement, he was
> not carrying the ball carelessly like Daniel
> Thomas was doing last years when all they had to
> do is "poke the ball out" as he passed by.
>
> Bush is a smallish back, not a Javorskie Lane who
> can be expected to outwrestle two guys.
>
> Plain and simple, you only criticize a guy when he
> carries the ball carelessly. If he is
> out-muscled, how can you criticize that?

Just for some perspective....Warrick Dunn was 5'9 180 lbs. He played for 12 years compared to Bush (6'-0" 200 lbs) who has been playing only 6.5 years. They both have 26 career fumbles.

I think most coaches would disagree with your theory that says you only critisize if they are careless.

I think if you ask any NFL coach they would say any fumble by a RB is careless. You don't say much to the guy who never does it because sometimes it is unavoidable....but for a guy who has historically had fumblitus....you may have to send a serious message until he shows that he gets it.

LT had a bad problem early in his career but then he was made to fix the problem. It was in the mechanics of the way he carried it. He fumbled 22 times over the first 5 years of his career and only 8 times over the next six years.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

montequi Wrote:
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> Everyone is still blaming Bush.


It took MORE THAN A DAY FOR ME TO GET IT BUT I AM ABSOLUTELY SPLITTING MY SIDES NOW.

Eesti and the Truth, there is no point arguing philosophy and that's what it really boils down to is coaching philosophy.

That what you call a fumble and WHAT I CALL A BALL RIP OUT occurred at a crucial point in the game (although it was only the first quarter) to me makes no difference. If he was carelessly carrying the ball that was one thing.

Your statement that ANY fumble regardless of whether the back was overpowered seems harsh to me and as other people have said, why not apply it to the Quarterback? Why not apply it to the receivers who drop passes? Why not apply it to Sean Smith when he drops an interception?

I think we all agree on Igcognito, the dumb SOB, but that was an intentional foul.

In my coaching philosophy, a high character guy like Reggie was upset enough on his own. I would have patted him on the back and said "Good run. Don't you dare blame yourself! Get your head back in the game. We need you."

I do not like the phylosophy of sitting a player because of one error.

I think thats wrong. Its not like he did it on purpose. The defensive players made a great play.

If he fumbles 3 or 4 times i could understand. But one fumble doesnt end the game.

Maybe bush could broke a couple of runs that changes the momentum of the game.

Reggie has 3 fumbles on 126 carries.

Thomas has 2 fumbles on 62 carries.

Coach Philbin, for some reason or another, won't let miller touch the ball. What in the world would we ever do if he insane happens and we have 2 rb's fumble the ball in the same game?

Oh, and you wanna talk about his performance? He finished the game with over 5 yds per carry. That's pretty good by any standards and there are a lot of coaches that'll take 1 fumble every 42 carries for a 5 yd per carry average.

IMO, the benching was justified.

Bush even said he would have benched himself.

Bush has been running poorly for the last 4 games(he's killing me in FF). Even on the run he broke for 15-16 before he fumbled, he didnt finish the run strong. He almost tackled himself. I think that's part of the message Philbin is sending: Run hard, or your out.

And uhhh...4 rushes for 22 yds = 5.5 ypc, with 1 run for 15-16yds, is a misleading stat. Reggie has been FAR from a 5 ypc back this year.

Daniel Thomas is running the ball closer to the way a power back is supposed to run...downhill. No dancing, no start-stop-start-2 yd loss runs. Thomas earned, through production, playing time. Simple as that.

Sure as long as he finally learned his blitz pick-ups.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

socalphin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> IMO, the benching was justified.
>
> Bush even said he would have benched himself.

Bush is a professional. Unlike a lot of nfl players nowadays, he won't speak against his coaches.

>
> Bush has been running poorly for the last 4
> games(he's killing me in FF). Even on the run he
> broke for 15-16 before he fumbled, he didnt finish
> the run strong. He almost tackled himself. I think
> that's part of the message Philbin is sending: Run
> hard, or your out.

Didnt finish the run strong? Did you see it? He was fighting for the first down and extra yards when he was stripped of the ball. If he had not finished the run strong, he never would've fumbled.
>
> And uhhh...4 rushes for 22 yds = 5.5 ypc, with 1
> run for 15-16yds, is a misleading stat. Reggie has
> been FAR from a 5 ypc back this year

Well first of all, he's not FAR from 5 ypc this year. He's 4.4 behind a ol that is not good. I agree, sometimes I wish he would just hit the freaking hole but that's not who he is and when he breaks off one of his 20 yd td runs when I thought he'd be tackled for a loss, I forget about that.

Second, a 16 yd run followed by 4 one yard runs is 5 yards per carry no matter how misleading you may think it is.



>
> Daniel Thomas is running the ball closer to the
> way a power back is supposed to run...downhill. No
> dancing, no start-stop-start-2 yd loss runs.
> Thomas earned, through production, playing time.
> Simple as that.

Uhhh, Daniel Thomas has fewer yards per carry, fewer TD's, and more fumbles per carry than bush yet he's earned pt through Production and bush should be benched? I agree...that is simple.