this who manning thing to me is beyond stupid. if he can still play at a high level bc he is fully healed, indy is not going to just let him walk. I don't care about the bonus, they will pay it or work something out. if they cut him, it's bc there are severe doubts about his medical condition and we shouldn't be signing him anyway. I just don't get this at all.

I've been screaming for a QB since they moved up for a RB and passed on Mallet last year.

I can see missing on a QB(Henne) but I can't stand it when they refuse to see the importance of a Franchise QB. (Ginn over Quinn)

Tired of taking other Teams back ups. I'd like to see RGIII taken in the draft. But understand the draft picks to get there might be too expensive.

I like the fact we have options.Looks like someone is serious about it. But how much time can Peyton have? We take Peyton then we still need to grab a QB like Weeden or Tanner..... See what happens I guess.

berkeley223 Wrote:
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> this who manning thing to me is beyond stupid. if
> he can still play at a high level bc he is fully
> healed, indy is not going to just let him walk. I
> don't care about the bonus, they will pay it or
> work something out. if they cut him, it's bc there
> are severe doubts about his medical condition and
> we shouldn't be signing him anyway. I just don't
> get this at all.

I don't know Berk, if they keep him and draft Luck, they would have 50 mil on the books for the QB position. Can they handle that kind of cap hit?

I know the logical thing would be for them to cut manning, but logic kind of goes out the window when you are dealing with franchise-defining players. I don't think we'd have just cut marino to save cap room, even if we brought in a hot shot rookie. Something will get worked out, I bet Indy reworks the deal where they pay him a lot of money for 1 more season and then they 2 can go their separate ways. I just don't see a healthy payton being on the market this offseason. And if he's not healthy, I don't want him.

You don't fully heal after you've had a cervical spinal fusion.

He's not just damaged goods, I'm going to say right now that there is no way, absolutely no way that Peyton Manning plays a full NFL season ever again. I don't even think it's a case of Manning being unable to perform at an acceptable level, but that he flat out just can't even do it.

Be very afraid if this isn't just misinformation from our front office.

berkeley223 Wrote:
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> I know the logical thing would be for them to cut
> manning, but logic kind of goes out the window
> when you are dealing with franchise-defining
> players. I don't think we'd have just cut marino
> to save cap room, even if we brought in a hot shot
> rookie. Something will get worked out, I bet Indy
> reworks the deal where they pay him a lot of
> money for 1 more season and then they 2 can go
> their separate ways. I just don't see a healthy
> payton being on the market this offseason. And if
> he's not healthy, I don't want him.


I agreed with this thought process 100% until I saw the combined cap #, I think I even argued with The Truth or someone about this subject, that Indy would never let him go. Then they dumped the Polians and I saw that cap hit. Irsay has a huge decision on his hands and if I was Manning I wouldn't rework anything.

I agree that for whatever reason there is at least some push to get a quality QB. I'm thinking that we have a smarter coach than we have had in years. That should help a lot.,

1. We however are still paying the price for the past coach and Parcels bailing out. Tony was stubborn and IMHO not the sharpest knife in the drawer when it came to selecting or developing a QB leader.
- Thus we will suffer in a year of outstanding draft quality by performing so well at the end of the year. (Well enough to push us just out of the sweet spot for landing a quality QB.)
- It would be awesome to get a quality QB in FA and pick up anpother skill position stud.

2. Not too happy that we lost Nolan, and I attribute that to bad luck, of not being able to close the deal soon enough. Else I think we could have kept him. We have talent though, and hope we can fill the DC with some talent like him.

3. It is so far past due for this team to have some intellect at both HC and QB. We have had neither in a very long time (except for the bried time we had pennington at QB, and he had some talent (arm strength & health handicaps)

4.

berkeley223 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> this who manning thing to me is beyond stupid. if
> he can still play at a high level bc he is fully
> healed, indy is not going to just let him walk. I
> don't care about the bonus, they will pay it or
> work something out. if they cut him, it's bc there
> are severe doubts about his medical condition and
> we shouldn't be signing him anyway. I just don't
> get this at all.


I have to agree. As much as I admire the career of Peyton Manning, he's damaged goods unless proven otherwise.

Why was he lingering on the Colts roster all year again? Not on injured reserve, yet not playing in games? The whole thing is just too weird.

Berk, Indy will not have 50 million wrapped up in the Qb position.

They are starting a new chapter there. Fired everyone. Bout to hire tressel who runs a Qb under center pro style offense. They are preparing for Luck.

Manning will not be in Indy even if healthy.

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"

we'll see. I just think you throw "logic" out the window when dealing with marino/manning types. I think manning reworks his deal and stays. If he's healthy I just don't see Indy cutting him and living with the prospect of seeing him succeed on another team.

They are stuck. they owe him $28 million before the season starts and before the draft.

they can't trade him until the season starts...ie. until AFTER they give him $28 Mill. Nobody is trading for a 36 yr old Qb who just had 2 neck surgeries and comes with a $28 million tag.

He won't work out for them because he it removes any leverage he has. Obviously he will be better in May than in January whatever his limitations are.

So...they have 3 options.

1) keep Manning...draft Luck...pay them both and release everyone who won't accept a paycut because they would be WAY!!! over the cap.

2) Keep Manning and use the draft to put talent around him ( pick a non-QB or trade the pick)

3) cut Manning and draft Luck.


Option 3 is the way this is going to go.

Keeping Manning active was so they could 'Suck for Luck' .

If you put Manning on IR you gotta sign another Qb.. and he just might go and win you some games.

Manning active...gives the plausible appearance of 'really hoping to get your starter back so you can win games'...which was BS all season long.

berkeley223 Wrote:
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> we'll see. I just think you throw "logic" out the
> window when dealing with marino/manning types. I
> think manning reworks his deal and stays. If he's
> healthy I just don't see Indy cutting him and
> living with the prospect of seeing him succeed on
> another team.


Yeah...ask Marino how that worked out for him. He voided his contract to help the team out....and they didn't offer him a contract.

so much for legacy.

There is no way Peyton reduces his salary to stay with Luck, unless he is truly not ever going to play again...
It is a no win situation for Peyton, he will be shoved out the door,with fans panting for Luck to get his shot, and that would put Peyton in a horrible situation for the end of his career...

The reason I like the idea of Manning if he is healthy, is we have a good back up in Moore if something were to happen to him... We also had one of the worst olines in the NFL, last year... If we dont fix that, it will be tough for any QB to be consistent winner... Going after RGIII, means we give up alot and will have a hard time filling the holes on the Oline...
The right moves to me, seems you have to solve the oline or QB position in FA... WHich one is it.... If we can trade away the farm to move up for Qb, and can still solves the problems of the worst oline in football, then I am all ears... But I think it appears that the oline pick in the first is probably the right move... Unless we have a hidden gem RT, FA we can sign... But I am not so sure about that move...
On a side note, What was the name of the guy that played LT all preseason, and then got hurt and was out for the season?... He could be the great majic hope at RT, but I am hardly convinced...

Lydon Murtha. He was terrible his whole career here but played well in camp last year.

He started LT all preseason when Long was out, and went to either Oklahoma or Nebraska? Big tall guy?

yup.
If we stay at 9, I think we end up taking OL yet again, since I think the highest rated guy on the board will be OL at the time, and it happens to be a position we need. Other than QB, we could really use a pass rusher, but I don't think there will be one there worth taking in the top 10.

Yeah, JC, Zach was probably, next to Griese, my favorite dolphin and when we dropped him, you'd think I would have been upset but I so cared for the man as a person that I was hoping that would get him to see the light and luckily it did.

JC Wrote:
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> That is one big-assed 'if' though.
>
> That's going to be a big gamble. Peyton is going
> to say he's healthy. Doctor's might. But then
> what happens the first time he gets hit (I think
> it still happens in the NFL, once in a while--the
> quarterback getting hit).
>
> I cringe the same way I cringed at the thought of
> Zach Thomas getting a head injury at the end of
> his career.


I hear ya JC. But I think if Peyton comes back, he personally would be the one making the decision... If he feels that neck injury is to much, I dont think he would risk it... I remember hearing similar feelings towards Brees being done, with his shoulder surgery on his throwing arm.. Some guys, bodies fall apart, some guys dont...I am not ready to count Manning out, unless he counts himself out...
Whats the risk, some cash, and I am sure an injury clause in the contract to protect the team long term from dead money problems...
Manning doesnt take alot of shots, the refs protect him like a deity.

Slimey like an oiled rattlesnake or slimey like an oiled pig, or some weird hybrid of the aforementioned slimey animals?

All these super rich rattlesnake pigs are cut from the same parasitic cloth anyway…

And we wonder WHY the game today sucks?

ChyrenB Wrote:
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> Yeah, JC, Zach was probably, next to Griese, my
> favorite dolphin and when we dropped him, you'd
> think I would have been upset but I so cared for
> the man as a person that I was hoping that would
> get him to see the light and luckily it did.


He did, but I was still scared for him that one last year of his career when he played for Dallas.

Crowder52 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> I hear ya JC. But I think if Peyton comes back, he
> personally would be the one making the decision...
> If he feels that neck injury is to much, I dont
> think he would risk it...

But I still fear that he *would* risk it. He's that fierce of a competitor.


I remember hearing
> similar feelings towards Brees being done, with
> his shoulder surgery on his throwing arm.. Some
> guys, bodies fall apart, some guys dont...


BIG difference between the two scenarios in my book.

You take a violent hit on an injured shoulder. Then ouch. May never throw a ball with that arm again. You may never may touch your toes with that hand or raise that arm straight up over your head.

Now, you take a violent hit when you have a neck injury involving your vertebral column? You could become seriously debilitated. That is much more scary than a shoulder injury scenario.


I am not
> ready to count Manning out, unless he counts
> himself out...
> Whats the risk, some cash, and I am sure an injury
> clause in the contract to protect the team long
> term from dead money problems...
> Manning doesnt take alot of shots, the refs
> protect him like a deity.

The risk is grave health ramifications with a neck injury. Watching a Phins game already has enough pins and needles without worrying about whether the QB will be messed up for life if he gets hit or even falls down a certain way.

Honestly, Manning should simply retire...it's just not worth the risk, Manning really has nothing else to prove to anyone. I mean he is going to the hall of fame, and he has a superbowl ring, a sh*t-ton of money, as well as many other accolades.

After his injury he should simply hang it up, and get either in the booth, or on the sidelines.

The thing with manning is there's a ton of "ifs" here, if he's healthy enough to play, and if the Colts cut him, and if he chooses Miami over the 10 other teams that'll show interest. Not real sure with a rookie HC running a West coast offense, that he'd wanna come here anyway, maybe but I have my doubts.

JC Wrote:
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> That sucks of him, but it's still better than
> filing for all-out bankruptcy and screwing them
> out of almost their entire investment (as Donald
> Trump did more than once with his real estate
> deals)


Of cousre he wouldnt file all out bankruptcy, that would take the control out of Ross's hand and into the trustee, this is just an inside deal that screws investors and mortgage holder, while entirely benefiting the owner who signed the agreements with his name and honor in the first place to all of the above...
Please tell me which one is forging on his responsibilites, and who benfits and who doesnt, and how it makes any sense to work out like that, while Ross keeps complete control of the assets and revenue...

..and Donald is also a slime ball as well when he has done this to investors and lien holders in the past...