samsam3738 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> eesti and the truth...
>
> Of course they are going to sign free agents to
> fill in positions...
>
> And i agree its impossible to do it with just the
> draft...
>
> My whole point is do not overpay or pay 3 or 4
> free agents who are great a huge amount of
> money...even though we are in good position as far
> as the salary cap is concerned.
>
> Again my whole point on this is now that we are ok
> salary cap wise do not go insane and overpay....
>
> This mess is not going to be solved in one year.

RESPONSE: This is exactly what I am saying. No more. No less.

samsam3738 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> eesti and the truth...
>
> Of course they are going to sign free agents to
> fill in positions...
>
> And i agree its impossible to do it with just the
> draft...
>
> My whole point is do not overpay or pay 3 or 4
> free agents who are great a huge amount of
> money...even though we are in good position as far
> as the salary cap is concerned.
>
> Again my whole point on this is now that we are ok
> salary cap wise do not go insane and overpay....
>
> This mess is not going to be solved in one year.

***********************************************************

Have no fear, Sam -- Ireland isn't going to pay big bucks for FA; if he does anything like that, it will be for one player; that guy he and Philbin designate as the one "they have to sign." Any other FAs that Miami grabs on to won't be top FAs; they will be guys who (hopefully) can wrestle away a starters job, and Ireland will pay them much, much less than that #1 guy they did sign for the big bucks.

Ireland has already said he isn't going to overpay, and I also (think) he said he isn't going to go overboard in FA. The draft will be his baby to get the team going in the right direction.

I'm sure he has already assigned a value to each of the top WR's. If the guy gets a bigger offer we will not go much over the original. Same as in the past....Matt Flynn, etc.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

So what is KC giving up for Smith? #1? # 34? Does he even fit the system? Matt Moore played pretty well in the WCO...for one game. I think the pick is for Joeckel.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

eesti Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So what is KC giving up for Smith? #1? # 34? Does
> he even fit the system? Matt Moore played pretty
> well in the WCO...for one game. I think the pick
> is for Joeckel.

*******************************************

No way KC gives up that 1st pick for Alex Smith. Very possibly a 2nd and a conditional (if that). Does he fit the system? Well, no one knows exactly what system KC will run, but knowing what Andy Reid has run in the past, Smith will fit in.

Some Mock drafts have KC taking Geno Smith #1, but I still say KC will go for a veteran and draft a QB in the 2nd or 3rd (depending on what they give up for A. Smith). Their first pick will then be OL.

I think Jacksonville is a likely destination for Smith. His former OC is now the HC.

KC could also make an offer for Nick Foles if Reid likes him.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

eesti Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think Jacksonville is a likely destination for
> Smith. His former OC is now the HC.
>
> KC could also make an offer for Nick Foles if Reid
> likes him.


What, no Tebow? Isn't that the most important question everyone has to answer? Where will Tebow end up?

Toronto Tebow

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

Is anyone buying the notion that Cordarelle Patterson is the only WR that makes sense for Miami at 12? Kiper said this today in an interview.

I don't really see any WR's going in the top 15. None that I would take a chance on anyway.

CP just doesn't have the experience to gamble on. Kiper said in 2 or 3 years he will be a stud. We don't have that much time to wait.

Ireland has done a good job IMO in the first round since he took over. Tannehill and Pouncey.

I would rather take the chance on Williams or Eifert than gamble on Patterson. Proven production.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

eifert at 12 is a super super reach. I don't want a WR at 12 for the very reason you note---most don't make much impact in year 1 and we need someone who can play at a very high level ASAP

________________________________________________________
The beatings will continue until morale improves.

We have what I predict will be a

GRADE A Quarterback (Draft)

GRADE A Center (Draft)

Grade A Tackle (Draft)

GRADE A Defensive end (CFL)

What have we gotten from free agency, Chad O. Brandon Marshall...nothing really to write home about except Reggie Bush.

What a WR DOES NEXT YEAR is IRRELEVANT!!!!!!

We're NOT GOING TO THE SUPER BOWL NEXT YEAR!!!!!!

Patterson and Allen are going to be GREAT RECEIVERS and ALL Pros in three years.

STOP GIVING UP ON THE FUTURE IN ORDER TO GET SOMEBODY'S GARBAGE.

DON'T PASS ON PATTERSON OR ALLEN and then try to sign them on the downside of their careers seven years from now.

Draft one of them at no. 12.

And I know you people. You've done it to me before.

When I turn out to be right years later, you are going to say, "This is Monday morning quarterbacking. Who could have known that these two guys are crashing all of Jerry Rice's records now??"

I don't see it as irrelevant because Ireland needs players that will contribute this year. No matter if we are not going to the SB. We still have to get to the playoffs.

It is right in theory to draft as you say but it isn't realistic for Miami this year.

Eifert is a super reach at 12. This time 3 years ago a certain TE would have been considered a super reach as well. Fast forward and redraft and he probably goes in the top 10 instead of 42...and is the first TE taken instead of Jermaine Gresham.

A lot of things can change after the combine too.

That being said, I doubt we take a TE or WR.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

eesti Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't see it as irrelevant because Ireland needs
> players that will contribute this year. No matter
> if we are not going to the SB. We still have to
> get to the playoffs.
>
> It is right in theory to draft as you say but it
> isn't realistic for Miami this year.
>
> Eifert is a super reach at 12. This time 3 years
> ago a certain TE would have been considered a
> super reach as well. Fast forward and redraft and
> he probably goes in the top 10 instead of 42...and
> is the first TE taken instead of Jermaine
> Gresham.
>
> A lot of things can change after the combine too.
>
> That being said, I doubt we take a TE or WR.


The need for immediate contributors is certainly pressing.

I'd like to see us sign a WR and draft one. I'd like to do the same thing at TE.

Give me Greg Jennings and Dustin Keller in FA.

Then draft either Aaron Dobson or Steadman Bailey at WR and one of Eiffert/Ertz/Kelce at TE and I'm gonna be REALLY happy with how we are positioned for next year and the near future.

Ditto. on Keller and Jennings and Bailey.

I have a feeling Eifert is going to be a stud. I doubt he or Ertz fall to round 2 unfortunately.

I would be happy with TE's Gavin Escobar or Kelcie.

What's the lowest we can get Bailey without losing him? That's the question.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

eesti Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ditto. on Keller and Jennings and Bailey.
>
> I have a feeling Eifert is going to be a stud. I
> doubt he or Ertz fall to round 2 unfortunately.
>
> I would be happy with TE's Gavin Escobar or
> Kelcie.
>
> What's the lowest we can get Bailey without losing
> him? That's the question.


I'm a HUGE Steadman Bailey Fan but the more I watch Aaron Dobson, the more I think he is the best WR for our system..with Bailey a close second.

I think one of them, maybe both will be there at our second pick. in round #2.

By the way, I know that THE TRUTH has at one early point indicated that we should draft Keenan Allen at no. 12. My reference to him is really based on his type of attitude about other opinions he has expressed.

is any wr we could get at 12 signafacntly better than one we could get in the 2d round? if not then go another direction at 12, apparently there are lot of good 2d/3d round wrs and we have 4 of those picks

________________________________________________________
The beatings will continue until morale improves.

berkeley223 Wrote:
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> is any wr we could get at 12 signafacntly better
> than one we could get in the 2d round? if not then
> go another direction at 12, apparently there are
> lot of good 2d/3d round wrs and we have 4 of those
> picks


That's exactly right Berk.

If all the WR's have warts, and there is little to no separation between the top 5 and the next 5...why take one at #12 when you can get one of equal value/risk at #42?

Is there really that much difference between the group of Corradelle Patterson, Keenan Allen, Terrance Williams, DeAndre Hopkins, Da'rrick Rogers and the group of Justin Hunter, Aaron Dobson, Steadmen bailey, Tavon Austin, Robert Woods?

Yes.

captkoi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ChyrenB Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Like I said, I just want to draft our top needs
> > first and then give a second look in free
> agency
> > to young guys who didn't make teams or even (as
> a
> > wild and crazy move) look at guys from the CFL.
> I
> > don't believe in guys from free agency.
> >
> > What's my bias?
> >
> > Don Shula. I think Paul Warfield is about the
> > only star we had that we didn't draft and he
> > basically came from the Browns almost the same
> > time as Shula came from the Colts.


Chyren, I agree 110% with you here. You are right on target.


>
> **************************************************
> *****
>
> Chyren, do these names sound familiar?
>
> Little
> Langer
> Keuchenberg
> Morral
> Buoniconti (not sure if he came in while Shula was
> there or before)
> There's more, but can't think of them off the top
> of my head right now.

If I'm reading Chyren right, he is talking about big name FAs. And he is absolutely correct, Shula stayed away from those players.


Not only were Buoniconti and Little before Shula's time, they were not Free Agents. Buoniconti was traded from NE for two scrubs and a fifth round pick. That was huge because Buoniconti was known to be a great LB at the time, and everybody knew that NE was getting the shaft on that one.

Little was traded from San Diego for a guy named Mack Lamb (who?). I'm not sure the Little trade was as well thought of at the time, as Larry had trouble seeing the field in San Diego. After Little's first year in Miami, he was an AFL All-Star, so I'm thinking San Diego regretted that one.


Keuch and Langer both debuted with the Dolphins. They were both bench warmers, cut by other teams 1-2 years after being drafted.

Morrall was an old QB meant to mentor Griese. He came over from Baltimore (where he played for Shula) a year after Shula, but its unlikely any other team would have signed him - Morrall was older than Shula at the time.

Armstrong was also a very favorable trade - we got him for a third round pick.

Anyway, I'm not seeing any player on this list that really points to Shula spending on big name FAs. He never did that - at least not until his last season.

Chyren here is absolutely correct. The glory years of this team were built up solid draft picks and some great wheeling and dealing by the FO. Those days left when Wanny started to run things, and won't return until we get a GM that knows his behind from a hole in the ground.

------------------------------------------------------------

Miami Dolphins. Always Perfect.

eesti Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ireland is not risking his job to stink for a high draft pick in
> 2014.

Agree.

Unfortunately for us, the guy may not be able to help it. Ireland is a bad GM.

Trying to explain away his bad GMing by saying he is trying to fail is the Pee Wee Herman defense. No, he didn't mean to do that, he just sucks.

------------------------------------------------------------

Miami Dolphins. Always Perfect.

dolfanmark Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Of course, free agency didn't start until the
> 1990's.

Free agents most certainly existed prior to the 1990's.

What was different is that teams had exclusive negotiating rights once a contract expired. But there were plenty of times when teams would just cut players because they didn't want to deal with the hassel of renegotiating a contract that would involve taking up a roster spot. And many of the players that left the NFL for the WFL and USFL returned to the NFL as Free Agents.

What changed in the 1990's was the availability of Free Agents.

As for Shula, Eric Green was the only big name Free Agent I recall having any impact. Shula built his teams mainly through drafts and young players that didn't make it with other teams.

------------------------------------------------------------

Miami Dolphins. Always Perfect.

DolfanKing Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> dolfanmark Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
Eric Green was the only big name
> Free Agent I recall having any impact. Shula
> built his teams mainly through drafts and young
> players that didn't make it with other teams.

Irving Fryar, Keith Byars and Keith Jackson all made the pro bowl after coming to Miami as free agents.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

That's exactly why this is one of those times when trading down is a great option. Hopefully a team or two fall in love with a certain player that drops to 12. I would rather have Tyler Eifert at 22 and an extra second rounder than a 25th ranked player at 12 that we could possibly get in the 2nd round.

It either take a huge gamble on a player like Cordarelle or try and trade down....or Sharrif Floyd to replace Starks.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2013 03:44PM by eesti.