I don't hate Tannehill nor Ireland, nothing would make me happier then to see these guys shine..But I defintely still waiting for the shine, Ireland it has been 5+ years, RT only 1. This year will be a big year for both of them.. I hope I am not saying the same next year .. Stay warm

-----------------------------------------------------------------
All things are subject to interpretation whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth.
Nietzsche



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2013 02:19PM by Crowder52.

i don't think martin played all that great that his re-draft of him in the mid-1st makes any sense

________________________________________________________
The beatings will continue until morale improves.

It seems to be based on how the teams see their own needs.

But I bet if you give every one of the 32 teams in the NFL, the first pick, and if he hadn't been injured in the final few games, RGIII would have come in first and Luck would be fighting with Wilson for no. 2.

What happen if RG3 never fully recovers from the knee injury? or injures it again.

Glad we got Tannehill.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

eesti Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What happen if RG3 never fully recovers from the
> knee injury? or injures it again.



Then we find out if he's a pocket passer who can run or a running QB...

Speaking of Tannehill, NFL Network had a segment this week asking a couple of analysts to name the quarterbacks who will lead their teams to the Super Bowl within the next few years. Former Eagles and Redskins quarterback Donovan McNabb surprisingly named Tannehill.

“I think Philbin understands his ability and what he’s able to do, being able to get out of the pocket and make plays that are kind of off schedule a little bit, and I think the defense will continue to grow,” McNabb said. “So watch out for the Miami Dolphins in three to four years.”

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

Donovan McNabb says Tannehill is going to the Super Bowl? Oh yea, watch out

------------------------------------------------------------

Miami Dolphins. Always Perfect.

I still don't get why people praise Ireland.

What exactly has he done? I suppose one can sound "smart" if they can argue that he has done a good job, or maybe they are just Ireland's buddy. I don't know. But I do know this - Ireland has brought us 4 straight losing seasons.

Four losing season is horrible. And yet we have a bunch of "Dolphins Fans" that defend this GM and claim anyone that criticizes him is a Jets fan. Logically, I would say that anyone that defends Ireland is the Jets fan, because they obviously must really like the results.

------------------------------------------------------------

Miami Dolphins. Always Perfect.

I'm sure you know more about QB's than McNabb ever did.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

That's probably the only thing I agree with you on DolfanKing.

ChyrenB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That's probably the only thing I agree with you on
> DolfanKing.

Oh come on now, I think we've agreed on a few other things. Certainly we both want the Dolphins to win.

You are indeed argumentative, but at least respectful. OK in my book.

------------------------------------------------------------

Miami Dolphins. Always Perfect.

Well, I had Tannehill's ability in mind.

DolfanKing Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Donovan McNabb says Tannehill is going to the
> Super Bowl? Oh yea, watch out

*******************************************************

McNabb said in about 3-4 years. Why is it you have such a hard time in being able to at least give Tannehill a chance?

DolfanKing Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I still don't get why people praise Ireland.
>
> What exactly has he done? I suppose one can sound
> "smart" if they can argue that he has done a good
> job, or maybe they are just Ireland's buddy. I
> don't know. But I do know this - Ireland has
> brought us 4 straight losing seasons.
>
> Four losing season is horrible. And yet we have a
> bunch of "Dolphins Fans" that defend this GM and
> claim anyone that criticizes him is a Jets fan.
> Logically, I would say that anyone that defends
> Ireland is the Jets fan, because they obviously
> must really like the results.

+**********************************************

Who on this board is praising Ireland?

What the majority of us are saying is that this is Ireland's chance to shine (this year). Let's see what he does or doesn't do.

If his draft choices and FA signings don't work out (get Miami to the playoffs, or at least in contention), then he's out. He does a good job and Miami gets up there, then he's in.

No one here is "praising" Ireland.

Ireland hasn't brought we fans 4 straight losing seasons; the Parcells/Ireland front office decisions and Sparano's coaching have. Then add a rookie HC last year, and we have that 4th losing season you are speaking of. Then consider the players. Have they played up to their potential? Nope. Dansby was supposed to be an All Pro every year, which is why Miami went after him. That hasn't happened. Hell, about the only guy really doing his job is Wake.

Granted, personnel decisions are on Ireland, and he hasn't exactly lit up the league. But, as I and many others here have repeatedly stated, give the guy his shot this year, as he has plenty of cap space to maneuver under and has 5 picks in the first 3 rounds of the draft.

If he can't get it right this year, then bye-bye.

Who says if Ross gets another guy in that he/she will do any better?

No guarantees in the NFL.

ChyrenB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That's probably the only thing I agree with you on
> DolfanKing.


****************************

What are you agreeing with, Chyren?

captkoi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> DolfanKing Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I still don't get why people praise Ireland.
> >
> > What exactly has he done? I suppose one can
> sound
> > "smart" if they can argue that he has done a
> good
> > job, or maybe they are just Ireland's buddy. I
> > don't know. But I do know this - Ireland has
> > brought us 4 straight losing seasons.
> >
> > Four losing season is horrible. And yet we have
> a
> > bunch of "Dolphins Fans" that defend this GM
> and
> > claim anyone that criticizes him is a Jets fan.
>
> > Logically, I would say that anyone that defends
> > Ireland is the Jets fan, because they obviously
> > must really like the results.
>
> +**********************************************
>
> Who on this board is praising Ireland?
>

Plenty. Heck, a few months ago, some jackass on this board insulted my mother because I criticized the guy.


> What the majority of us are saying is that this is
> Ireland's chance to shine (this year). Let's see
> what he does or doesn't do.
>

Certainly you are saying that. But do you speak for The Majority? I think Irelands "chance to shine" was two seasons ago. Year 3. He should have been fired at the end of last season, but wasn't because the owner had no clue. He was given a pass by some fans because he drafted a popular guy at QB in the first round (BTW - that guy still hasn't really shown he has the goods... but Tannehill isn't really the point here). But simple logic dictates that if, after three years, the team is going in reverse, then the guy should be fired. For some reason, it didn't happen here.

You are giving him 5 years, and if the past is any indicator (with NFL GM'ing it usually is), he won't shine this year either. So are you saying it is OK to just wait another year even though the Ireland has shown he can't run the team anywhere but into the ground? If so, then you are just prolonging taking a look at another GM for another year.


> If his draft choices and FA signings don't work
> out (get Miami to the playoffs, or at least in
> contention), then he's out. He does a good job
> and Miami gets up there, then he's in.
>

His draft choices and FA signings haven't been working for years. What is so special or magical about this year? I don't get your point here. Are you saying that the guy will, out of nowhere, start making good moves? Hasn't happened yet, and the likelyhood that he will all of the sudden become a good GM like Cinderella is very slim... maybe even a Fairy Tale.

------------------------------------------------------------

Miami Dolphins. Always Perfect.

Let me explain why we praise Ireland. In my opinion, he's been better than:

Wanny
Spielman
Mueller

Not so sure how he rates against Saban. It's all relative

I defend Ireland as much as anyone on this site but I can't think of many who actually "praise" him.

I'll argue with some about when the clock starts ticking on Ireland in so far as moves being his or his bosses, but I still maintain he's been average or maybe slightly better than that since Parcells left.

I just give credit where credit is due.

He had a very good draft in 2012.

He didn't panic and overpay in cash or picks for so-so QB's like Kevin Kolb, Matt Flynn and Kyle Orton

He finally drafted a QB in the 1st round.

He made a good trade for Reggie Bush.

And it looks like he made a quality hire with his first head coach (and staff).

But he still has to win. Which he hasn't. And the clock is ticking...

Hey dolfanking.........................ThEe JESTS STINK....

THE Truth Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I defend Ireland as much as anyone on this site
> but I can't think of many who actually "praise"
> him.
>
> I'll argue with some about when the clock starts
> ticking on Ireland in so far as moves being his or
> his bosses, but I still maintain he's been average
> or maybe slightly better than that since Parcells
> left.
>
> I just give credit where credit is due.
>
> He had a very good draft in 2012.
>
> He didn't panic and overpay in cash or picks for
> so-so QB's like Kevin Kolb, Matt Flynn and Kyle
> Orton
>
> He finally drafted a QB in the 1st round.
>
> He made a good trade for Reggie Bush.
>
> And it looks like he made a quality hire with his
> first head coach (and staff).
>
> But he still has to win. Which he hasn't. And
> the clock is ticking...

VERY fair and unbiased assessment without the exaggeration BS.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

eesti Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> THE Truth Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I defend Ireland as much as anyone on this site
> > but I can't think of many who actually
> "praise"
> > him.
> >
> > I'll argue with some about when the clock
> starts
> > ticking on Ireland in so far as moves being his
> or
> > his bosses, but I still maintain he's been
> average
> > or maybe slightly better than that since
> Parcells
> > left.
> >
> > I just give credit where credit is due.
> >
> > He had a very good draft in 2012.
> >
> > He didn't panic and overpay in cash or picks
> for
> > so-so QB's like Kevin Kolb, Matt Flynn and Kyle
> > Orton
> >
> > He finally drafted a QB in the 1st round.
> >
> > He made a good trade for Reggie Bush.
> >
> > And it looks like he made a quality hire with
> his
> > first head coach (and staff).
> >
> > But he still has to win. Which he hasn't.
> And
> > the clock is ticking...
>
> VERY fair and unbiased assessment without the
> exaggeration BS.

I was going to change my signature to: "Fair and Balanced" but I didn't want to get sued...

DolfanKing Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> captkoi Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > DolfanKing Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > I still don't get why people praise Ireland.
> > >
> > > What exactly has he done? I suppose one can
> > sound
> > > "smart" if they can argue that he has done a
> > good
> > > job, or maybe they are just Ireland's buddy.
> I
> > > don't know. But I do know this - Ireland has
> > > brought us 4 straight losing seasons.
> > >
> > > Four losing season is horrible. And yet we
> have
> > a
> > > bunch of "Dolphins Fans" that defend this GM
> > and
> > > claim anyone that criticizes him is a Jets
> fan.
> >
> > > Logically, I would say that anyone that
> defends
> > > Ireland is the Jets fan, because they
> obviously
> > > must really like the results.
> >
> > +**********************************************
> >
> > Who on this board is praising Ireland?
> >
>
> Plenty. Heck, a few months ago, some jackass on
> this board insulted my mother because I criticized
> the guy.
>
*****************************************

That just sounds like two guys that have a problem with each other, IMO.

******************************************
>
> > What the majority of us are saying is that this
> is
> > Ireland's chance to shine (this year). Let's
> see
> > what he does or doesn't do.
> >
>
> Certainly you are saying that. But do you speak
> for The Majority? I think Irelands "chance to
> shine" was two seasons ago. Year 3. He should
> have been fired at the end of last season, but
> wasn't because the owner had no clue. He was
> given a pass by some fans because he drafted a
> popular guy at QB in the first round (BTW - that
> guy still hasn't really shown he has the goods...
> but Tannehill isn't really the point here). But
> simple logic dictates that if, after three years,
> the team is going in reverse, then the guy should
> be fired. For some reason, it didn't happen
> here.

***********************************

I am speaking mainly for myself, but unless my memory or reading skills have failed me (which I hope isn't true), then most of the posters are not praising Ireland. Ireland's chance to shine is right now, not two seasons ago. You seem to want to dismiss the power of Parcells. What he said was the law. Ireland was just a figure-head. He may have given Parcells some input, but Parcells made the final decisions. Therefore, Ireland didn't really have full control until Parcells left. He has had a couple of decent drafts and off season moves since he has been in charge. He has refused to overpay, i.e., Soliai, Flynn, etc.

As far as the owner not firing him after last season, I highly doubt it's because he didn't have a clue. Didn't Ross have Wolf(?) advising him? If I were to guess, I would say that Ireland made a good pitch to both of them as to the state of the Fins, i.e., money, and his opportunities to improve the Miami Dolphins this year because of where they are in cap money and the number of draft picks they have, especially in the first three rounds.

As far as him choosing Tanny....RT did a good job, not great, but not poor, either. Many NFL "in the know" experts are predicting good things for Tanny. So, as with Ireland, Tanny has earned the right to show what he can do this year. He "should" have some weapons around him. If he does, and does poorly, then it's just another mistake by the brass, and its a guarantee that Ireland will be gone after the season, if not before. This is the year for both of them to show what they can do. Give them the chance, King.

I disagree with your statement about the team going in reverse. The team finished with a 7-9 record. That is a one-game improvement over 2011. No big deal and I would agree with you on that, but...the team itself showed a lot of improvement. Most every game they were in it, could have won if a break or two went their way. Yeah, I know, some of the games could have gone the other way, also. But, the desire and attitude of the team, as a whole, improved under Ireland's choice of HC, Philbin.

****************************************************
>
> You are giving him 5 years, and if the past is any
> indicator (with NFL GM'ing it usually is), he
> won't shine this year either. So are you saying
> it is OK to just wait another year even though the
> Ireland has shown he can't run the team anywhere
> but into the ground? If so, then you are just
> prolonging taking a look at another GM for another
> year.

***********************************

"He won't shine this year, either." Can I borrow your crystal ball? I need to check on a few things as far as my future goes. Yes, I am saying it is OK to wait another year. Ireland, IMO, has NOT run the team into the ground. As he has stated publicly on many occasions, he has built his program to where it stands this year, and this is the year he is able to make his moves.

You say Ireland should have been fired earlier? Who says anyone else that Ross hires will be any better? Besides, don't you think with a little patience, more often than not, things improve? Evidently, Ross has a lot of confidence in what Ireland can do, so he is giving him the opportunity to do it this year. He fails, see ya!

*******************************************
>
>
> > If his draft choices and FA signings don't work
> > out (get Miami to the playoffs, or at least in
> > contention), then he's out. He does a good job
> > and Miami gets up there, then he's in.
> >
>
> His draft choices and FA signings haven't been
> working for years. What is so special or magical
> about this year? I don't get your point here.
> Are you saying that the guy will, out of nowhere,
> start making good moves? Hasn't happened yet, and
> the likelyhood that he will all of the sudden
> become a good GM like Cinderella is very slim...
> maybe even a Fairy Tale.

************************************************

Once again, I disagree with your first statement. Your bitterness towards Ireland is clouding your judgement as to what has been happening in Miami. His signings have not been great, but he has had some good signings. He has been even better at not paying the big bucks to players who were (relatively) hot on the market, turning out to be correct in his assessments of those players. I can't predict that Ireland will make great moves this season. At times, a player can be drafted who is thought to be All World and for one reason or another, fails at the NFL level. That is, at times, the FO's failing; other times it is just something that no one could have foreseen. But then again, maybe you could allow Ireland the use of that crystal ball I mentioned (above).

*****************************************************

4 reasons why Tannehill will be a much better QB this year.

Intellect: He learns from his mistakes and rarely makes the same one twice.

Experience: 30 starts is the key. He now has similar experience as the other 2012 QB's (RG3, Wilson and Luck) when they came into the league. RT has 36 starts. 16 of which are in the NFL. That's even better experience than college.

Environment: We will have more talent around him this year with players that fit the system instead of project big holdovers.

Dedication: He needs to learn. He thrives on knowledge.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

captkoi Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> His signings have not been great, but ....

I hear this and I cringe. This is basically the way everyone that is pro-Ireland starts a conversation. But, after five years, if this is how you need to start a conversation on the GM, then that GM needs to go.

------------------------------------------------------------

Miami Dolphins. Always Perfect.

DolfanKing Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> captkoi Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > His signings have not been great, but ....
>
> I hear this and I cringe. This is basically the
> way everyone that is pro-Ireland starts a
> conversation. But, after five years, if this is
> how you need to start a conversation on the GM,
> then that GM needs to go.

***********************************************

You gotta finish the sentence to get the full gist of it. To finish it: "...but he has had some good signings."

This isn't just Ireland, there are a lot of GMs that anyone could start a sentence the same way when speaking of them. Ireland HAS had some good signings, but for some reason you choose to ignore that and focus on the one's that didn't work out.

And you seem to still be stuck on that 5 years, completely ignoring that Parcells was in FULL CHARGE of Ireland's first two years in Miami.

I understand your dislike for Ireland and wanting Miami to do much better than they have in every facet of the organization. I have a feeling I have been a Finfan way longer than you have (don't want to give away my age )and I have been discouraged by this last decade of Dolphins football, but to blame one guy is wrong. Why is it you haven't put any blame on Parcells?

I'm not positive, but have you ever mentioned Parcells and how he went about controlling the Fins in a poor manner? Many on this board and the other board I used to be on, hammered him for picking Jake Long with the #1 pick instead of Matt Ryan. I didn't exactly hammer him as I understood his philosophy of building from the inside out (i.e., Oline then skill positions). I believe he never met a QB that he liked to ever get picked in the first round. Just wasn't in his makeup.

THIS is Ireland's baby, this year. This is the year he proves himself or gets fired. I am willing to give him that opportunity to show what he can do (or can't do). What is one more year going to hurt?

I also noticed that, after answering your earlier post in great detail with my thoughts, the above is all you could come back with.

That, in a nutshell, shows where your thinking is....HATING IRELAND!

That's right.

Ryan Tannehill is the only person responsible for the terrible offense.

Ireland is entirely responsible for Bill Parcels.

Ross is entirely responsible for the 6 crappy season Miami had prior to him buying the team...including the 1 win season.

What don't you understand?

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

In defense of Parcells, if Matty Ball Ryan is the only QB we could have drafted instead of waiting for Tannehill, I don't think he screwed up that badly. I mean it's not like he passed on Luck, RGIII, or even later round picks like Wilson and/or Kaepernick.

I'm sorry, but all of Ireland's ills can't be laid at the door step of Parcells.

People have to keep in mind, the difference between Parcells' personnel and Philbin's personnel is huge. Everyone says this is Ireland's year. The reality is that it is going to take time to turn this roster over.

Parcells believed in bigger, stronger. Philbin wants faster, smarter.

The o-line was built for a straight ahead, man blocking scheme. That's what Parcells believed in. Philbin wants an athletic, zone blocking scheme. That's two different kinds of players. The only 2 guys who actually fit Philbin's plan are Martin and Pouncey.

The defense was built for a 3-4, which is what Parcells believes in. Philbin (and Coyle) want to run a 4-3. That changes the kind of players you want in your front 7.

It is going to take some time to really make this roster fit what Philbin wants. It's easy to replace the weaker guys. The tough part is the good players who don't necessarily fit (Incognito, Bess, Soliai, Odrick, for some examples).