Sun Sentinel gave a list of new offensive and defensive starters but I'm not sure if it is speculation or official.

They have Berger starting at C, Incognito at LG and Jerry at RG. This would give us an all new interior this year with only Carey and Long as returning incumbents.

I am confident all these can can play effectively but still have doubts as to whether Berger is better than Grove. Garner is on IR so it looks like Thomas will be the backup at RG and Corey Proctor at LG. This also leaves us VERY thin at backup tackle.

Defense has Misi and Wake as starters at OLB. It will be interesting to see how much time IAF gets at LOLB and Anderson gets at WOLB.

Other than that no surprises.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers

I think with the exception of the Berger/Grove thing the starters have been announced.

The OL is a big concern. I expect them to struggle as guards and center is new and really not top quality. Shame as this area should have been upgraded. Sure hope I'm wrong.

The offensive line isn't a concern. Jerry is legit at RG. Berger/Grove I see as one in the same, and Incognitio has experience and is no big let-down to Nate Garner in my opinion.

With the exception of John Jerry its pretty much the same o-line as last year that we had a lot of success with.

the line as looked horrible so far so I don't know how you can say it's not a concern. Jerry is a rookie and so far hasn't shown he's anything great, maybe in time but not now. Berger is not better than a healthy Grove. And Incognito has bounced around and was cut by the Bills who don't have the greatest line.

Last years line was good but not close to great. If not improved then expect the same results even with Marshall. It concerns me as Henne needs time to throw. He's green as heck and is still learning to check down. Without time he and we can be in trouble.

The OLine really? We will have a top 5 oline. The interior of the Line looked good against ATL. The pressure was coming from the outside and the TE's, Tackles and Rb's failed to pick up the blocks and really just missed assignments. That is all that I saw. The missed assignments and Fasano got bullrushed and so did Ricky on a play or 2 when screens were set up and ATL blitzed heavy and the play brokedown. But the Oline is fine, they just are not playing as a cohesive unit yet, they were confused and didnt react to one side being overloaded and blitzed. In the Jax game Berger was getting bullrushed but in ATL, I agree both centers played about the same, which was good enough but not spectacular. We are a better run blocking line then a pass protection line, I will agree with that. The area of improvement for the line is defintely pass protection. But I do not see how our Oline could be described as horrible in any way, shape or form.

berkeley223 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> the line as looked horrible so far so I don't know
> how you can say it's not a concern.

Because these games don't count!! The year the Lions went 0-16 they went 4-0 in the preseason. You are putting way way WAY too much stock into these games and what you see. There is no gameplanning. It's all vanilla. It means nothing

We have mixed and matched on the oline for over a month now. Once we settle on the starting 5 we will be fine

MikeO Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> berkeley223 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > the line as looked horrible so far so I don't
> know
> > how you can say it's not a concern.
>
> Because these games don't count!! The year the
> Lions went 0-16 they went 4-0 in the preseason.
> You are putting way way WAY too much stock into
> these games and what you see. There is no
> gameplanning. It's all vanilla. It means nothing
>
> We have mixed and matched on the oline for over a
> month now. Once we settle on the starting 5 we
> will be fine

Mike I hope you are right. I have seen nothing to rave about with the OL. By the third PS game we should at least see some consistency there.
The first half of the game we had only 10 yards rushing and the ground game should be our biggest strength. Yes it's PS, yes there is no real game plan, but come on, we should look better than we have.
As far as the interior, guard to guard, goes, we pretty much sucked. And yes I watched the first half at least twice.

its tough to be consistent when you are switching CENTERS every other possesion. When we are rotating in guards every few series. They are glorified/televised practices

Leon In Denver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> As far as the interior, guard to guard, goes, we
> pretty much sucked. And yes I watched the first
> half at least twice.


I am not sure what to say, I watched it a few times and didnt see what you saw. I am a bit baffled. Even Sparano, who bashed the whole teams performance in multiple press conferences, made it a point to single out the interior and said they played good.

Well I saw our center and at least one guard on each running play get very little push. I saw Atlanta's interior line get push back on running plays. I saw Atlanta's linemen man handle our center and guard on several pass plays. I saw the end of half stat of a lousy 10 yards rushing.
In my book, that is a poor performance.

Mike, I understand that they are switching centers and guards trying to find out who to start. What I'm saying is that by the third PS game the starters should be playing and getting their consistency down. Then in the second half the subs start coming. Sparano was still looking. That tells me they are behind schedule. Here's hoping we see them establish something that resembles a real line next PS game.

One thing I will agree with you on. If they don't look good against Buffalo, it's going to be a long season. Atlanta was a test, and the line failed.

With more blitz packages, our coverage should be better and we may be able to compensate for the weak play at FS. Our linebacking corp is MUCH improved. We have 2 solid NTs and depth at DE. Vontae Davis is on his way to a pro-bowl this year, and Will Allen WILL be back at some point. Bell is also playing well, as usual.

Offensively, play calling should improve once we start game-planning. Our O-Line may take a game or 2 to gel, but having fewer injuries at C and G will help in that! Ronnie and Cobbs look to be fully back. Ricky is just as strong as last year. Hartline played well last game. We know what Marshall and Bess can do. Henne has a good core of players to work with.

The ONE BIG part that I'm REALLY worried is special teams coverage. If we continue to blow coverage and give teams good field position, or worse...give up points, we're going to have a tough time winning. Blocked punts will also kill us!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/01/2010 12:41PM by montequi.

Phinsfan I hope you are right. But I don't see this line being much more than average. You can look at stats all you want. They don't mean much in preseason. But the line jelling together from the 3rd PS game on is what we should be seeing. We are not seeing it.
They were still trying to figure out who will play where. That means they are behind schedule.
We can't give them a couple of games. We need to win both of the first two and should win big. Christ, we are playing Buffalo.

Next game we should see the OL come together and play very well as long as the starters are in there.

Concerned? Your not, but I am. Hope you are right.

How can an oline jell when nobody is playing next to each other for 2 or 3 series in a row??

This is why our coaching is lackluster at times and Sparano is not a big-time caoch. They say we can't get off to a slow start each year and its gotta stop. But its his fault we start slow. Pick 5 starters, name a center for christ sakes its not that difficult and be done with it. This rotating of centers and guards to this late date is insane.

i agree 100% i think the main problem is the constant shufflng of the o-line. the difference bw the interior lineman is marginal so just pick 3 and go with it, let them get in synch for a few weeks before the season starts at least

MikeO Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> How can an oline jell when nobody is playing next
> to each other for 2 or 3 series in a row??
>
> This is why our coaching is lackluster at times
> and Sparano is not a big-time caoch. They say we
> can't get off to a slow start each year and its
> gotta stop. But its his fault we start slow. Pick
> 5 starters, name a center for christ sakes its not
> that difficult and be done with it. This rotating
> of centers and guards to this late date is insane.


Couldn't agree more. Too many games, too late in the off-season. This is impacting the team.

That's what I'm talking about. Way behind schedule. You can't expect any line to play well with all the changes, and you can't tell if they will be any good until you see them play well consistently. That should have started last game and it did not.
I guess we will see next game but don't hold your breath.

Surprising as Sparano was an OL coach.

It just occured to me, that this is his plan!

Its genious really, but I get it.

He is keeping the other teams guessing.

I bet all of this is just for kicks, and come week one its on!! BuffalOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO will get destroyed!!!! mwahahahahahahahaha Brilliant Sparano simply brilliant!!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/02/2010 09:08AM by Mia1.

Leon In Denver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Surprising as Sparano was an OL coach.

HC always seem to do worst in areas they were position coaches for. Remember Sabans secondary was just horrible. My theory is that HCs think they can coach these units to be better rather than going to get good players and letting them play. When they were position coaches, the HCs could always hold them in check. Now they are the kings, they have enough rope to hang themselves, and they often do.

You guys are crazy.... We had one of the best running game and Olines in the NFL last year. Our Oline will only be better this year then last... Of all the things 2 worry about with this team, I am flabberglasted, you guys are focusing on the Oline... The Oline? Come on

Our o-line concerns me with Incognito, he is supposed to be a good blocker, but his pulling is weak, which does not boyd well with wildcat, and Jerry will have up and down games, because he is a rookie.

To say they will be better is not a good judgement call.

When healthy Smiley was a top notch guard, and we better hope that Incognito will fill that roll to a T, but I'm not convinced yet.

I hope Jerry turns out to be a beast, but to early to tell yet!

Im nervous, but hopefull that they will become a elite o-line, but if Berger is our starting center, then we will lack in the running department, and since Grove is always hurt Berger will most likely be starting 3 to 6 games this year, so Im not to enthralled!

Center in next year's draft will be a big priority!! Its a must!!

Crowder52 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You guys are crazy.... We had one of the best
> running game and Olines in the NFL last year. Our
> Oline will only be better this year then last...
> Of all the things 2 worry about with this team, I
> am flabberglasted, you guys are focusing on the
> Oline... The Oline? Come on


I agree. I never want to hear I'm the "negative" one on this site.

So far this preseaon I have read our o-line stinks, we should cut Clemons, and our offensive coordinator is horrible based on preseason games!

I don't get it.

MikeO Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Crowder52 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > You guys are crazy.... We had one of the best
> > running game and Olines in the NFL last year.
> Our
> > Oline will only be better this year then
> last...
> > Of all the things 2 worry about with this team,
> I
> > am flabberglasted, you guys are focusing on the
> > Oline... The Oline? Come on
>
>
> I agree. I never want to hear I'm the "negative"
> one on this site.
>
> So far this preseaon I have read our o-line
> stinks, we should cut Clemons, and our offensive
> coordinator is horrible based on preseason games!
>
>
> I don't get it.


Well Im glad to see you remain positive on somthing!

Mia1 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> To say they will be better is not a good judgement
> call.


I dont think so MIA, our Oline had alot injuries last year. Smiley played well yes and especially pulling but he was not in the game all that much, maybe 50% of the season. Guys that defintely will not start or might not make the team were starting last year towards the middle to end of season in both Guard Spots. The Center situation is the same as last year. How can't the Oline be better? Our guards are better, Our tackles and centers are the same and it appears the depth has been improved across the line. I dont think our line is coming apart because we lost Smiley.

MikeO Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> I agree. I never want to hear I'm the "negative"
> one on this site.
>
> So far this preseaon I have read our o-line
> stinks, we should cut Clemons, and our offensive
> coordinator is horrible based on preseason games!
>
>
> I don't get it.

I didnt read anyone say to cut Clemons? Really? I am not for him starting and think he should be further developed but cutting him doesnt make much sense since the guy is only a second year player..



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/02/2010 11:07AM by Crowder52.

So your saying its a good judgement call to assume this years O-line will be better with a Rookie RG, and a LG who isnt as good pulling than Smiley was?

Ok differant strokes for differant folks I guess.

I'm not saying it can't be better, but Im just not convinced, because frankly as others pointed out that our run game has been non exsistant this pre-season, and yes gelling is a MAJOR contributer for that, but again time will tell, and we all hope that they become the best O-line.

I don't like Berger that much, he is ok, but the stats don't lie when he started last year our running game shrunk!!

Will be no differance this year, if he play's over Grove.

Grove is a solid center when healthy, but he has proven that he doesnt care about his body, or he is just a fragile guy, either way he is always hurt!!