Phinsfan2 Wrote:
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> So its OK for the owners to void the last CBA they
> negotiated and to lock out the players without
> paying the contracts that they negotiated with
> them but its not OK for the NFLPA to do whatever
> they can legally to improve their bargaining
> position?
>
> That makes absolutely no sense.


It is this that has me scratching my head, i'm not understanding the backlash towards the players and the seemingly free pass the owners are getting through all of this...........perplexing

Because man. Look Im all for paying the player what they signed on the contract, and if they don't give what they promised then they should be sued.

Im with the fact that WHAT PURPOSE is there to start your own business, if you have to give everything you do and give it to your employees, then have them protected by some BS union, and opt out of being a union, whenever it benifits them.

Its rediculous, pay the players what's owed on the contracts they signed, then you the owner's come together, and tell all the players to kick rocks, and come up with your own damn rules regulations, and invite all who want's to play according to your term's.

That simple, if the players dont like the term's start your own damn business.

That's what I'm upset about the most.

Let me explain I for one am so tired of the players thinking the league is about them, and that they deserve the money their making. I really believe if it wasn't for the NFL very few of the players could make a living in the real world. So I have very little regard for individuals who's only real talent is to play a childs game for money. The owners allowed the salaries to get too big, and they have to take control of this situation. Where else is Dez Bryant going to make a living give up I rest my case.

I DONT WORK FOR MCDONALDS, WANA KNOW WHY???? THE PAY SUCKS AND THE BENEFITS ARE HORRIBLE@!!!!! THE JOB IS HORRIBLE, THERE FOR I CHOOSE NOT TO WORK THERE!!!!!!


Just like the NFL, IF THE PAY ISNT GOOD ENOUGH, OR THE BENEFITS THEN I WON'T WORK THERE!!!! HOLLY SHNIKES WHAT A CONCEPT!!!!

Man this stuff is like PLATO serious man!!!

Phinfans, the players are not partners with the owners that is the biggest farce being sold. If they were partners they would not collect their income as ordinary general income, taxed in the highest bracket. They would do what partners with a vested interest do like all of the owners and ownership groups, they pay capital gains in a much lower scale. Owners are taxed as owners (partners) and the players are taxed as employees that is truth. So anyone that claims the players are partners with the owners doesnt understand the definition of business partnerships, vested interest, investments, employees,etc.

Do the players have to worry about paying the estate tax on their partnerships worth....lol

Phinfans if the NFLPA can convince the federal govt they are partners, then I would buy the argument, but you and I both know they will always be defined as employees, in every form that determines monies and finances and that does matter, it matters a whole lot.
Look the owners have to come up with an incredible amount of money to the feds everytime a family members dies and the team changes hands. What essentially destroyed the Robbie families involvement with the Dolphins. I didnt hear any players, willing to come up with the 100 plus million they had to pay the govt in taxes based on the value of the Miami Dolphins organization at the time. These NFLPA players are nothing more then some employees that have serious dilusions of grandeur and are completely unrealistic about business.

You are basicly saying that there is not one legal document that backs up your argument, and a ton legal documents that back up what I am saying but we should throw that all out, because you say it doesnt matter. You cant really be saying that, am I misunderstanding?

I'm with Finshady on this - Time to give the game back to the fans and pay the players a good fair price, but allow the NFL risk takers to make a buck and the Fans to see and atend aan affordable product:

Bottom line keep the TV contracts money for players, olower the gate prices.

Crowder, the owners have said exactly what phinsfan is saying by entering into the CBA they had, they're beef isn't sharing some of the profits, it's how much to share. Why can't anyone see that?

Phinjim Wrote:
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> I'm with Finshady on this - Time to give the game
> back to the fans and pay the players a good fair
> price, but allow the NFL risk takers to make a
> buck and the Fans to see and atend aan affordable
> product:
>
> Bottom line keep the TV contracts money for
> players, olower the gate prices.


Are you seriously suggesting the owners aren't making a decent buck right now?

Phinsfan the owners also made a fair offer to the Players that they turned down, I love how you frame the argument with treasure as if the owners did not make a reasonable offer to the players before the lockout and the players refused to counter offer and choose to decertify. They way you framed some of your responses it sure left that part out...lol



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/30/2011 12:18PM by Crowder52.

Exactly the Owners made one hell of a offer, that I would have taken, but noooo not good enough. Never good enough. Nope

The last one made before the decert.

Giving a couple years to pay the players what was owed, lowering rookie pay scale, providing better services to the vets, and more safty, increasing the vet min right? I don't know all of it, but when reading about it looked ok in my book.

I think the owners overpaid the players in the last CBA, is what I think, but looking at it now as you put it, no its not a great deal, but again I want the salaries lowered to begin with, but I dont know.

You make a compelling case.

Can you answer me if the NFLPA is so fair, why are the NFL Alumni, pretty much with the owners and against the NFLPA.

What makes some of you people think that by lowering player salaries that it will lower ticket prices? The affordable games ship has sailed a long long time ago and it isn't ever coming back.

Decertification is the cause of the situation today, again that is another fallacy that it isnt. The 2 sides were negotiating the owners made the last offer. The players walked away from the negotiating table, that is fact. The owners want to be dealing with the federal appointed mediator, the players chose the tactic of walking away which triggered the chain of events, including the decertification and then the lockout.
SO no matter how you spin, the players create the impasse we are at, and that was by walking away from the mediation. They are the responsible party for this month of nothing but waiting for a hearing.

Phinfans, what you leave out is the debt and cost of debt, and estate tax problem that these franchises are having. The new stadiums cost a billion dollars to build, the tickets are already overpriced, the salaries are outrageous and have not stop growing despite the declining economy and ticket sales. The business of owning a NFL team is broken, no matter how you spin the story. It should not be broken with the amount of money the NFL brings in, the reason being is the current bad CBA, and tapped out pricing, declining ticket sales and higher salaries. The NFLPA would destroy the NFL, if you let them. The care takes are the owners, I believe the people see that.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/30/2011 02:20PM by Crowder52.

Crowder52 Wrote:
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> Decertification is the cause of the situation
> today, again that is another fallacy that it isnt.
> The 2 sides were negotiating the owners made the
> last offer. The players walked away from the
> negotiating table, that is fact. The owners want
> to be dealing with the federal appointed mediator,
> the players chose the tactic of walking away which
> triggered the chain of events, including the
> decertification and then the lockout.
> SO no matter how you spin, the players create the
> impasse we are at, and that was by walking away
> from the mediation. They are the responsible party
> for this month of nothing but waiting for a
> hearing.


A real stretch of the facts Crowder, the owners were locking them out at midnight, the players had to decertify by 5pm EST or it would of cost them 6 months before they could file the anti-trust lawsuits. You could argue that they should still be negotiating but if the players didn't decertify by 5 the owners would of walked out of that building with bigger chubs then Smiling Bob.