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          Flores Fired
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This is a moderated phorum for the CIVILIZED discussion of the Miami Dolphins. In this phorum, there are rules and moderators to make sure you abide by the rules. The moderators for this phorum are JC and Colonel
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Flores Fired
Posted by: astro34 ()
Date: January 10, 2022 05:11AM

What the hell is going on?

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: socalphin ()
Date: January 10, 2022 05:31AM

If Chris Grier is retained, then we have a more serious issue at hand.

That issue is that team owner Stephen Ross is a completely clueless fool, and will continue to run this organization into the ground.

Sorry Dolphans, our team is in the hands of idiots, and there's nothing we can do.

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: colonel ()
Date: January 10, 2022 05:34AM

Holy Crap Marie!!!

Yep, something was going on following the game yesterday during the post game interview with Flores. He should have been exuberant over the win, beating the Patriots twice in one season. That is a major accomplishment. Now it all makes sense. He knew he was toast.

The Merry-Go-Round continues. Now what? Is Chris Grier next. He should be, if Flores got *&^%-canned.

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Re: Flores Fired
Date: January 10, 2022 05:43AM

This is not a good move.

Ross will be going after Harbaugh in a big way. Good or bad on that front , I don't know. But the players have got to be pissed off.

Shit.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: jsm08 ()
Date: January 10, 2022 05:46AM

Grier retained. The narrative pushed by Grier and the organization is "relationships".

Grier has Ross' ear and will survive anything.

We won't be relevant until Ross is gone.

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: mizzou15 ()
Date: January 10, 2022 06:32AM

I think its the right move. I said before the season if Flores did not improve on last years 10 wins then he should go. I would have asked Flores to fire all of his offensive coaches. I can see Flores refusing to do this so we terminate all. I think Flores will be better served for his experience w/ the phins (as was Campbell) but we cannot invest anymore time with his staff 'learning on the job'.

I have 3 major issues with Flores;

1 His OL coach
2 His OC coordinators
3 Not learning from his mistake switching Fitzpatrick's position. Did the same thing w/ Eichenberg and that cost the Oline months of development time. Coaches putting their own 'signature moves' over team development is costly. Learn from your mistakes and move on. Flores was too young a head coach to be stubborn.

Too many coaches better than Flores out there. Tough move but it was the correct one imo.

NP w/ Grier again a more experienced head coach would have gotten more wins from this team

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: astro34 ()
Date: January 10, 2022 07:06AM

Whatever the reason was, there obviously was an issue.

So who do we get now? I would say Lincoln Riley but he is snugly at USC. I would not even begin to know who to speculate. The guy at North Dakota State? I am soooo confused.

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: tsstamper ()
Date: January 10, 2022 07:24AM

Not saying you're wrong about too many better options out there, but would love to hear the short list.

I actually think he learned from mistakes and:
a) demonstrated it over the last 1/2 of the season
b) got more out of the talent than many coaches would have (speaking of 2.5 years of his tenure...admittedly the first 1/2 of this season was a cluster and I think a lot of it had to do with the design on the offensive staff side which happened under his leadership, so they underperformed there)

His achilles was not being able to put together a legit offensive staff. Would have been nice to have seen if he could have done it and have that thrive while we get the benefits he brings to the table.

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: astro34 ()
Date: January 10, 2022 07:31AM

I am not saying there is not good coaches out there. I just can't think of any because my head is spinning. I do agree with you that the offensive staff was his major problem.

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: jsm08 ()
Date: January 10, 2022 07:33AM

Doug Peterson
Jim Harbaugh
Bill O'Brien

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: pafinfan ()
Date: January 10, 2022 07:49AM

???

I'm not going to say I agree or disagree because I'm not sure and i want more information but...

How the heck did Grier keep his job?

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: jlyell13 ()
Date: January 10, 2022 07:56AM

His early season and staff hiring mistakes and failure to get to the playoffs cost him.


Pederson or Harbaugh and Ed Dodds replacing Grier



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/10/2022 07:59AM by jlyell13.

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Re: Flores Fired
Date: January 10, 2022 08:05AM

Guys. There is no other option. Harbaugh will be calling Xs and Os next season. They will float a bunch of other options , mostly because they have to satisfy the Rodney rule before hiring him. But Ross is going after his Michigan legacy.

As far as TUA /Watson goes......thats up to Harbaugh, an ex QB and offensive minded coach.

I'm a defensively minded person and have really enjoyed this defense. I hope this won't signal forgetting defense and building another lopsided team.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: colonel ()
Date: January 10, 2022 08:43AM

Since Shula we've had 8 head coaches. The best after Shula was Jimmy Johnson followed by Dave Wannstedt. Then the list of failures is long. Saban, Cameron, Sparano, Philbin, Gase and now Flores.

When we lose a HC position, assistant positions change when the newcomer brings his new staff of assistants. Offensive and defensive schemes change and winning over the current team membership becomes a task.

It doesn't matter what relationships Flores had with his players, that's history. It now matters what kind of relationship the new on the field management will bring to the organization and I am mainly referring to the players. The honeymoon with the new HC, whomever it will be will last only so long with Ross and Grier, IMO. If the new HC takes charge and wins...that relationship will continue to blossom. Getting the relationship to blossom with the players is first and foremost, again my opinion.

I too am confused on what will be next. Did Ross already have coach X selected following the big loss to the Titans? Maybe. Did Ross start to look for a new HC when the teams was 1-7? Maybe. However, my guess is Y-E-S! The saving grace was the winning streak but likely went to hell after the Titans debacle.

With this change at HC, are we going through another rebuilding program? I hope not. That mentality needs to end. Putting your finger in a light socket over and over hoping you don't get zapped is down right crazy. Improve the weak spots. We know where they are, just ask any rabid Dolphins fan. Fix those and we will have a damn good, competitive team.

One last parting word on this post--Chris Grier needs to go.

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: Hooligan2 ()
Date: January 10, 2022 08:46AM

This really shows the warts of the organization. Flores' first season his team was pulled out from under him in a bid to tank for Tua. He wasn't even allowed to pick his own QB since he has said he wanted Herbert. In his 2nd season his hand was called from up above like, "We want you to play Tua instead of Fitzpatrick, yeah he's still limping a little and he doesn't really know the playbook but, do the best you can." The clown show continues and I hope Ross chokes on a big exploding cigar.

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: tsstamper ()
Date: January 10, 2022 08:58AM

Yeah, I don't think rebuild should be on the table. We have legitimate young talent and some notable veteran talent AND our cap is in good shape. I think a rebuild is in order when you assess that the whole thing isn't working and doesn't have a reasonable chance to work on the player talent/cost side.

Without knowing the inner stuff that I'll probably never know and, like the rest of us, have to try to piece together from leaks and body posture/voice tone during press conferences, etc., I don't think now was the right time to get rid of Flores. But, my opinion could change w/new info.

That said, I think we should be a relatively attractive option from a talent/youth/cost perspective. The ownership stuff is a downside wildcard that only has downside, seemingly.

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: mizzou15 ()
Date: January 10, 2022 09:01AM

NO COLLEGE COACHES, except Harbaugh who has had success at the nfl level.

Not sure Harbaugh is leaving MI just when he is on the verge of starting something big or Ross would want to take him away from his alma mater. I would welcome him.

No sympathy for Flores, Fitzpatrick was simply not the future for the Phins.

We have to hire a coach that will bring in a solid staff with him. Flores' staff was incompetent.

A short list of candidates who I think will bring in solid coaches:

Brevell JAX interim HC - Think its time for him to be a HC

Pederson

Leftwich - same as Brevell

Caldwell - age but solid coaches would flock to him

Others Hackett & Bienemy

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: astro34 ()
Date: January 10, 2022 09:28AM

We know it won't be Meyer or Gruden

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: tsstamper ()
Date: January 10, 2022 09:30AM

mizzou15 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> NO COLLEGE COACHES, except Harbaugh who has had
> success at the nfl level.
>
> No sympathy for Flores, Fitzpatrick was simply not
> the future for the Phins.
>

Not implying you're wrong, but are you basically saying that the main reason for Flores' firing was his wanting to keep Fitz as starter over Tua? (perhaps this being what Ross conveyed as "communication & collaboration" )



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/10/2022 09:31AM by tsstamper.

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: mizzou15 ()
Date: January 10, 2022 09:39AM

Nope was responding to the comment to paraphrase 'that Flores was told to replace Fitz w/ Tua'.

I do not know why Flores was fired.

I do agree with the dismissal.

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: captkoi ()
Date: January 10, 2022 01:36PM

Wow. This one took me by complete surprise. Not expecting this at all.

First season, got his team from the joke of the NFL to winning 5 games. Second season got them to 10-6. Third season got team in the record books by losing 7 straight then winning 7 straight. Swept the Patriots for the first time in a long time. Got our defense to be one of the top defenses in the league.

Football wise, I don't think that was Flores' downfall, unless we consider last year's debacle vs Buffalo, then this year's against the Titans.

Well, its done and over with, so here's hoping Ross gets it right, this time.

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Re: Flores Fired
Date: January 10, 2022 03:52PM

I agree X's and O's wasn't the issue with Flores. The offense wasn't great but it wasn't so bad he deserved an ass kicking. This is about personalities. Flores doesn't strike me as a "yes" man.

Another tidbit...... Did you know Ross was going through a divorce? It's possible he's just in a real pissy mood. Needed to kick an ass to make his Wrinkled Billionaire ass feel better.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: jsm08 ()
Date: January 11, 2022 03:01AM

Yes men work in his real estate empire not the NFL.

Chris Grier is a yes man and that's why he always survives regime changes and why this team will always suck.

Everything the team is leaking to a select few in the media is to save face. Has anyone read an article form "sources close to brian flores"?

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Re: Flores Fired
Date: January 11, 2022 03:36AM

No doubt " Selective leaking" creating a reason to get rid of Flores because he just didn't deserve to be fired. No one wants to get rid of a Head coach. It's a severe culture change and it will change the team No matter who is playing. Usually teams are searching for reasons to Save a HC not fire one.

Think about that. Why? Flores is loved by the fans , the players. Hes a solid individual, no off field issues. Why?

Early on I commented on reports him and TUA didn't see eye to eye. He was benched last year. I think that started it. I think when he was hurt and we went 1-7 the writing was on the wall.
Ross said.....hes done. Then we went 7-0 and he wasn't.

So we didn't make the playoffs and they hang him on one game? 12 hrs later!!!?

You don't need to be a detective to figure out something is planned and has been for a while.

IMO it's Ross's Michigan legacy. He loves that Alma matter more then the Dolphins. He's in contact with Harbaugh all along . Harbaugh needs a piece of equipment, a suana, some new Ice booths for his Michagan players? Call uncle Steve.

Now uncle Steve needs him. I'm sure of it because what else could it be? 12 hrs after the game ended....this was pre planned. Remember when they picked Waddle ? 25 seconds and that pick was in. They knew who they wanted. No time here. No conversations. Just a kick in the ass for a man who didn't do a bad job. Ross hung on to much much worse for much longer. Remember Philbin? Geez.......

Something is already in the works. For a while. What else could it be? Coach Harbaugh. There are going to be alot of negative reactions from players

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: Flores Fired
Date: January 11, 2022 03:39AM

No doubt " Selective leaking" creating a reason to get rid of Flores because he just didn't deserve to be fired. No one wants to get rid of a Head coach. It's a severe culture change and it will change the team No matter who is playing. Usually teams are searching for reasons to Save a HC not fire one.

Think about that. Why? Flores is loved by the fans , the players. Hes a solid individual, no off field issues. Why?

Early on I commented on reports him and TUA didn't see eye to eye. He was benched last year. I think that started it. I think when he was hurt and we went 1-7 the writing was on the wall.
Ross said.....hes done. Then we went 7-0 and he wasn't.

So we didn't make the playoffs and they hang him on one game? 12 hrs later!!!?

You don't need to be a detective to figure out something is planned and has been for a while.

IMO it's Ross's Michigan legacy. He loves that Alma matter more then the Dolphins. He's in contact with Harbaugh all along . Harbaugh needs a piece of equipment, a suana, some new Ice booths for his Michagan players? Call uncle Steve.

Now uncle Steve needs him. I'm sure of it because what else could it be? 12 hrs after the game ended....this was pre planned. Remember when they picked Waddle ? 25 seconds and that pick was in. They knew who they wanted. No time here. No conversations. Just a kick in the ass for a man who didn't do a bad job. Ross hung on to much much worse for much longer. Remember Philbin? Geez.......

Something is already in the works. For a while. What else could it be? Coach Harbaugh. There are going to be alot of negative reactions from players who went from a guy they could relate to , to a guy who is used to bossing college kids around. This isn't going to be good. Ross doesn't get these young players mentalities. He's wayyyyy out of touch.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: mizzou15 ()
Date: January 11, 2022 03:50AM

If its true as Schefter says that assistant coaches and who makes decisions were the primary issues between Ross and Flores again I am happy that Flores and his deadbeat assistants are gone.

Flores is not the victim here the Phins are. So we had a 7 game winning streak & beat teams we were supposed to beat. Yeah we beat the Pats twice with their rookie QB, guess what we were supposed to beat them. We were also supposed to be JAX, ATL and split w/ the Bills. If we went 12-5 and fired Flores then I would be ticked. He can take Jeanpierre (1st year OL coach), Grizzard (You really going to make this guy WR coach! Watching film is not the same as coaching players)and his 2 OC w/ him to screw up some other team.

Defensive coaches were not much better. Defensive players can figure things out and take matters into their own hands more so than offensive players.

This coaching unit would continue to get their a** kicked by the big boys.

Flores was smoke and mirrors. The press is not going to dig deep into the incompetence and qualifications of this staff. You sucker more readers by victimizing Flores and playing up the Flores vs Ross/Grier story line. He beat Belichick twice hooray!

If we bring in Daboll I would be happy. I would be happy if we brought in Mike Shula, get Flores the hell out of Miami.

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Re: Flores Fired
Date: January 11, 2022 03:57AM

No. TUA got injured. His health cost us 4 more games easy. That was not Flores fault. He didn't bust TUA up. He coached admirably. His defense was killer. Not perfect but certainly not deserving of the first NFL coach fired in 2022. This was pre planned. It's obvious and the players see it too.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: mizzou15 ()
Date: January 11, 2022 04:15AM

Not buying the koolaid or excuses. We should have beaten JAX, ATL and split w/ the Bills. You can see the inadequacies of this staff on the field. Players will not revolt they will appreciate quality coaching and respond to it. When a coach leaves another steps up players say 'let's go play'. No time for drama let's go.

A coach is only as good as his assistants.

All I can say I expect the next coach to do better coaching the majority of these players in 2022.

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Re: Flores Fired
Posted by: colonel ()
Date: January 11, 2022 04:40AM

I guess we'll never know the reasons (more than one) why Flores was fired. Common sense tells me it was the losing streak and blow out by the Titans that was the final straw. Yet, Ross seemed to imply that it was a personality conflict between the coach and the GM administration. Flores didn't play nice with Grier. Flores was too obstinate etc, etc.

In my own experience, when superiors are on a certain path they expect subordinates to follow even when the subordinates aren't fully in lock step. They must carry out the goal of the superiors. I can only surmise that since Ross comes from a corporate superior-subordinate environment, he became aware of Flores not wanting to follow direction of his superiors (Ross/Grier and others in between). Hence, the personality conflict could not be overcome and that led to Flores' dismissal. Not following the corporate path is risky business. Flores, then, wanting to be his "own man" and bucked the higher-ups was his downfall. This was amplified during the season with talk about Watson, Tua being traded, the big losing streak and other foolishness.

Without a doubt, we'll never know for sure. All we outsiders can do is try and connect the dots in some logical manner to make sense out of another 3-year head coaching change.

I do hope that Ross has begun the search for a replacement that will fit his criteria and that it leads to harmony so the franchise can stop being an eye-roller to fans and talking heads on radio and tv. Of course, the replacement has to be proven this time with assistants that will improve the offensive.

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Re: Flores Fired
Date: January 11, 2022 07:53AM

All great comments. None of us will know for sure. But I really thought this team was turning a corner. We didn't make the post season but we got a taste of winning again. To not build on that and just strip it all away makes no sense. I know it's the same team .......so far anyway, but a HC change is drastic. Culture , so much will change. For the better? God knows there was room for improvement. We are all powerless to just do anything but watch and hope. It's just one thing after another with this team.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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