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          What do we do now?
Miami Dolphins Civilized Discussion :  Phins.com Phorums The fastest message board... ever.
This is a moderated phorum for the CIVILIZED discussion of the Miami Dolphins. In this phorum, there are rules and moderators to make sure you abide by the rules. The moderators for this phorum are JC and Colonel
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What do we do now?
Posted by: dolphan4545 ()
Date: October 10, 2021 12:03PM

I'v been a fan of this team since the Longest Game in 1970. I don't know if I can take this anymore. This is worse than going 0-7 two years ago, we were supposed to be bad then but the future looked bright. Well, the future is here and it's TERRIBLE. I'm totally pissed off at Omar Kelly, Travis Winkfield, and Kyle Crabbs, and other mouthy bastards in local media who made it almost impossible for the Dolphins NOT to draft a small, slow, weak-armed injury-plagued QB as our "franchise quarterback". Joe Rose, Dave Hyde, You guys were RIGHT! Of course, I'm not too happy that the Dolphins allowed them to influence that pick. There were PLENTY of others, both national media and Dolphins fans that apparently didn't know that college football IS NOT the pros. This kid has been able to contribute nothing to this team. I wasn't shy about not wanting them to draft this kid as were some of you.(I KNOW that you don't believe me, but the proof is in the archives of this podcast) I have always thought Kelly had a good handle on most positions on this team, but never on qbs. He can't tell a bad QB from a hole in the ground. He makes excuses for them- he even did it with Tannehill! He is still doing it. Personally, I think we ought to give Reid Sinnet a try. If he's bad, we haven't lost anything- except maybe another game. Tua sucks-Brisset sucks-we need another QB! a decent QB!
The rest of the team isn't exactly good, too many high draft picks haven't lived up to expectations. Nobody is playing well, with minor-and temporary- exceptions. I'm tired of throwing up every Sunday. And, I'm tired of Tua's supporters making excuses for him- we've all seen him play- he isn't the answer. Face facts, you fools.

Rick

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: jlyell13 ()
Date: October 10, 2021 01:09PM

Been a phin fan as long, and feel the same. Hoping I am wrong about Tua , but the Grier Flores debacle needs to end. Go get Pederson and start Sinnett and see what we have. Should have traded or released Parker, Williams, Wilson can't stay healthy

Defense just dominated again today but Bucs have depth. Byron Jones Noah Igbinoghene overpaid busts

Offense wasn't bad but should have drafted a top RB this year or last and average qb miss the deep ball open targets

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: colonel ()
Date: October 10, 2021 02:38PM

Inadequate coaching, inadequate assessment of talent, wishful thinking, over estimating draft prowess, and the inability to hire top notch assistant coaches who can develop players is a systemic problem. Year-after-year it goes on.

I am seriously doubting Flores' ability to "right this ship."

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: colonel ()
Date: October 10, 2021 05:13PM

Lemuel Jeanpierre is the offensive line coach and Shawn Flaherty is his assistant. Are they at the heart of the O-lines failures? Could be, I don't know. Am I grasping at straws?

Charlie Frye, our first year QB coach? Minimal experience. Is he part of Tua not developing? Could be. I don't know.

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: tsstamper ()
Date: October 10, 2021 06:07PM

I think they're far from the only problems, but having our 3rd different OC in 3 yrs (and this time it's co-OCs) and 4th OL coach in those 3 yrs is absolutely a huge part of the problem.

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: mizzou15 ()
Date: October 11, 2021 03:45AM

Jeanpierre does not know what he is doing. It is reflected in his units performance. Flaherty is like 26 years old Im not sure what he could teach a veteran olineman. All of this is on Flores. My understanding is that the coach picks his assistants in the nfl. Flores staff is not on the front office its on him.

We lose against the Jaguars the Phins should cut bait w/ FLores. If he cann't beat 2 college coaches, Meyer/Charlie Strong he needs to go. Jaguars do have some good offensive coaches Bevell (who I would like to see as a HC), Schotteheimer (should be ready for a HC position), Warhop (oline) and Parms (Parmalee). We should beat them w/ our O matched up against their D..

Our drafting Tua is on the front office not the press. You have to gut up and take the QB you want. They wanted Tua.

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: colonel ()
Date: October 11, 2021 04:24AM

When you watch other good to very good teams they usually have a good to very good offensive line and more often than not, a QB that is improving with each win.

Mahomes is sensational. Josh Allen is amazing. Murray is Mahomes-like and then of course there's Herbet, a pick we didn't take who is exceptional. No one knew at the time those players were drafted that they would become great players. Tua was a risk because of his injury, so he had a strike against him already. Many of us here thought it was a decent pick but with the injury caveat always present to see if he could A) recover and b) actually play well at the NFL franchise level.

Thus far Tua, shows intelligence, but he is not durable. His passes are weak compared to the other QBs mentioned above. Again, all QBs must have time to think, exam the field, and then make a play. Our current o-line is nothing more than an experiment. Shifting players around like "musical chairs" each week is feeble.

At this time, coaching seems to be inadequate and what talent there is, is falling way short. All of this is on Flores. He has to take the heat. The front office, once again, misjudged the coaching talent in the hiring and over estimated the prowess and trainability of players on the roster.

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: socalphin ()
Date: October 11, 2021 05:52AM

What do we do now??

Fire Chris Grier and start an extensive search for a new GM.

Grier has single-handedly destroyed this franchise. This jack-ass has me longing for the days of Jeff Ireland and Dennis Hickey!

This whole debacle needs to be flushed, and it's time to start over...again.

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: mizzou15 ()
Date: October 11, 2021 08:21AM

I think our players are trainable and developable. The coaches cannot do either one. I did not see yesterdays' game (my son is 20 now and not a big nfl fan. If he wants to do something w/ his old man I am there on Sunday's) but I read this morning that the Phins moved Austin to LG and Eichenberg to LT. I have been calling for this move probably since June. If an average high school football player can see the stupidity of some of the Phins moves and the coaches do not get it until October that is just sad.

I caught a little of the WA vs Saints game and Washington was performing w/ Heinicke at QB. The line (which does not have a 1st round tackle on its roster) was competent. The skins are not winning but they are competing. Joe Matsko (the OL coach) is over 70 years old and his assistance is over 40 and played in over 100 nfl games. Im saying they have solid OL coaching.

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Re: What do we do now?
Date: October 11, 2021 08:51AM

We need to start at the top. Fire the GM. Start assembling some people who have a clue and can lead. And can make good knowledgeable draft picks.

And I hate to say it.....firesale. Howard, Parker, collect draft picks. S
Back to the drawing board but with competent people.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: What do we do now?
Date: October 11, 2021 09:29AM

Flores is downplaying everything says the team is just out of Snyc.


Miami Dolphins coach Flores says the team is 'out of sync,' something that is a concern BY MIAMI DOLPHINS OCTOBER 10, 2021, 6:24 PM Miami Dolphins head coach Brian Flores talked to the media after their 45-17 loss against the Tampa Bay Buccaneers during their NFL football game on Oct. 10, 2021 and said that the team is "out of sync."


I think its much more then just a matter of "timing". But hey what the hell do I know? eye rolling smiley

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: mizzou15 ()
Date: October 11, 2021 09:34AM

I have no doubt that a credible coaching staff could win with our current roster. I do not have an issue with the talent that Grier has assembled. I would terminate him on the hiring of Flores and allowing him to bring in incompetent assistants.

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: pafinfan ()
Date: October 11, 2021 03:26PM

TreasurecoastPhinsfan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Flores is downplaying everything says the team is
> just out of Snyc.
>
>
> Miami Dolphins coach Flores says the team is 'out
> of sync,' something that is a concern BY MIAMI
> DOLPHINS OCTOBER 10, 2021, 6:24 PM Miami Dolphins
> head coach Brian Flores talked to the media after
> their 45-17 loss against the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
> during their NFL football game on Oct. 10, 2021
> and said that the team is "out of sync."
>
>
> I think its much more then just a matter of
> "timing". But hey what the hell do I know? eye rolling smiley


Ah... the team is "out of sync". OK. I wonder if their is a person who's job it is to put them in sync... Like maybe the Head Coach. Will Flores be able to figure that own out.

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: pafinfan ()
Date: October 11, 2021 03:39PM

I really believe the only way Miami is going to get good coaches is to fire everyone and.... start again. Yet again.

Truthfully is you were an up and coming offense, defense or even special teams assistant coach would you want to work for the Dolphins?

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Re: What do we do now?
Date: October 11, 2021 03:41PM

I read that Howsrd got burned yesterday for 3 touchdowns and almost 300 of Bradys 411 yds.

He must of been way out of sync huh?drinking smiley

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: dolphan4545 ()
Date: October 11, 2021 07:50PM

Perhaps, but I agree with Mike Lombardi: Tua had the best PR blitz I've ever seen using a lot of happy talk and about five plays shown over and over and over and somebody(s) bought into it hook, line, and sinker. The only medical opinion that they got in that whole runup to the draft was out of Tua's camp. Not exactly an NFL medical staff, and certainly not objective. Yet, they also bought into that- with the help of the local media, who had already bought in because it fit their narratives and they insisted it was of course true. The bunch of them simply refused to acknowledge anything that was even a possible negative, blithely just skipping over anything that they didn't want to hear. They, all of them, got really good at shouting down anybody that didn't agree with them. Just another part of the PR blitz. I'm disgusted.

Rick

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: dolphan4545 ()
Date: October 11, 2021 08:02PM

Ok, and just who might that be? Do you really think it is that easy? And, how do you play the games without enough players? Who we gonna tank for this time?

Rick

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: dolphan4545 ()
Date: October 11, 2021 08:06PM

So- now Howard has no talent?! Think about that.

Rick

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: colonel ()
Date: October 12, 2021 04:24AM

Assume for a moment that there are many talented players on the team and all that is lacking to get them to achieve is better training. If that is the case, improving the level of training is what is needed. Then the question becomes, are the people tasked with the training capable of improving their teaching and coaching methods. If part of the answer is yes, perhaps an infusion of "former NFL stars" as advisors to the coaching staff member would enhance things. There would be no requirement for a firing of the coaching staff, just an infusion of ex-player talent to assist them in the training area.

I can think of several former Dolphins that played defense that might be able to provide teaching tips to the current group of defense linemen and linebackers. There are other greats from other teams that could share playing skills on offense too.

All of this comes down to "tweaking" what is in place now. I don't like having to start over each season with new coaches with different ideas that I believe confuses and destroys cohesive play.

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: mizzou15 ()
Date: October 12, 2021 04:57AM

Respectfully Colonel, the coaches are payed for a reason. You cannot have 'too many voices' in the players ears brings added confusion. That is what I think bring in former players will do. Former players will also have to stay within the scheme of the coaching staff's O or D.

Unfortunately I think this problem goes beyond tweaking. Lamar Jackson looked unsalvageable after his rookie year. The Ravens did an excellent job of developing him in his second year. We cannot develop guards how can we develop qbs? NFL coaching is not on the job training and I think that is what we have going on here.

Phins are derelict, not being able to get an int from a rookie qb, the Oline situation, the nickel and dime play calling on O. Like him or not Tua was a successful college qb and had some damn good tape out there. Protect him and I think he will develop. If the Ravens can develop Lamar Jackson we should be able to develop Tua.

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: 808phan ()
Date: October 12, 2021 06:57AM

What do we do now?

Stick our heads in the sand or wear paper bags over our heads instead of face masks. Miami's sh!t show is reality, year after year.

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Re: What do we do now?
Date: October 12, 2021 07:10AM

mizzou15 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If the Ravens can develop Lamar Jackson
> we should be able to develop Tua.


I agree with alot of what you say......but comparing Lamar Jackson to TUA is like comparing a unreliable broken down Ford mustang to a new mid engined Corvette.

Both capable of great things but one has the platform to make it happen. The other needs new tires and a tune up every three weeks.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: tsstamper ()
Date: October 12, 2021 08:35AM

I also don't think we need to completely start over. Flores has a history of leading a collection of players & coaches to overperform. This stretch is unusual for his tenure with us, and, sadly, many of us can say that we saw some of the issues he's dealing with and even working to correct (see OL). I just don't think he all the sudden forgot how to coach or the players all the sudden lost their talent. It's a bad funk, but I think it's best to work out of it.

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: colonel ()
Date: October 12, 2021 11:27AM

Tweaking the coaching staff is an approach to solving what appears to be lousy coaching. It's an idea, just like firing the entire coaching staff. What ideas, if any, does Flores have to correct the dismal showing of the play this season? Hmmm, keeping things the same and "praying" things will improve? Maybe. I sure don't know. My suggestions mean nothing to the franchise. In fact, all of our dismay and disappointment mean nothing to the franchise. The franchise is a business and they sink or swim based on business decisions. So far, as most of us have pointed out, the franchise management does "stinking-thinking." It happens yearly despite efforts to change coaches and assistant coaches. If they continue to do that with the hopes of "hitting the big one" it will be like an 1849 prospector searching for gold looking to hit the mother lode. Doing the same thing over and over and hoping to get better results is insanity. Tweak what's there and change the routine--just my unpaid voluntary suggestion.

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Re: What do we do now?
Date: October 12, 2021 12:33PM

I'm not a Flores hater. I fact I think he can still be a great coach. But he needs to get better assistants Pronto because this bunch is killing the team.We have some pretty talented people on defense that are not getting the adjustments needed to be successful.

That said the offense is a much bigger problem. The oline is just not performing at a NFL level and I hate to say it. Unless he comes back and plays a full season....TUA is not the answer we were hoping for. He just can't take a summer of intense practice and a new 17 game schedule. We are already 1-4. Could have easily been 0-5 without a great play by Howard. Playoffs are looking slim to none. Unless TUA comes back and can magically turn the offense around. I'd start evaluating for a new QB and some Free agent Oline help. Especially a center.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: tsstamper ()
Date: October 12, 2021 12:46PM

Regarding assistants, are there any available right now for the Offense that could be had?

On defense, we have the same coordinator as last year and I'd hate to think that the loss of KVN & McCain (replaced by a younger but more talented Holland) made that big a difference.

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Re: What do we do now?
Date: October 12, 2021 01:19PM

tsstamper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Regarding assistants, are there any available
> right now for the Offense that could be had?
>
> On defense, we have the same coordinator as last
> year and I'd hate to think that the loss of KVN &
> McCain (replaced by a younger but more talented
> Holland) made that big a difference.


Cant see anyone worthwile unless hes long retired ....to come in and help the OC postion. SO Flores needs to evaluate what they are doing and change it. Pronto. Quicker slants becuase our Oline sucks. Maybe running plays designed to be successful with what we have. They have a ton of tape. We scored 17 points last week. What worked and what didnt!? Figure it the hell out.

On defense again watch the tape . what worked and what didnt?And Why? Why did Howard all of sudden lose 300 yds and let 3 TD's go?

The Jags have the worst ranked defense in the League. We should have no problem game planing against them. We are not out of Snyc! We are not Playing to the opposing teams weaknesses. Addressing their strengths. Jags have horrible corners. AIR IT OUT.

Figure it out and attack it. or find some people who will. This is sickening.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: mizzou15 ()
Date: October 13, 2021 12:20AM

Im just not sold that this situation can be corrected by this staff. If you compare each member of the Phins coaching staff to their counterparts on the top 10 teams in the nfl you will see why they are getting their clocks cleaned on Sundays. CLEV has Callahan as OL coach w/ NFL veteran G Scott Peters as his assistant. They have Kevin Rogers as a senior O assistant. Rogers is a noted QB coach and has a solid offensive mind, Im sure he is playing a major role in Mayfield's success.

You cannot fix a problem in the nfl in mid October by adding new personal to your staff (IMO). One thing we know, Bill Bellichick assistants have terrible records as head coaches. This was known before we hired Flores and I have no faith that Flores will break the trend. If we go less than 10-6 this season I would cut bait and hire a new HC.

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: dolphan4545 ()
Date: October 17, 2021 12:17PM

Of course. They may look like shit right now, but they are still an NFL team.

Rick

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Re: What do we do now?
Posted by: dolphan4545 ()
Date: October 17, 2021 12:19PM

I seriously doubt it.

Rick

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