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          Burrow
Miami Dolphins Civilized Discussion :  Phins.com Phorums The fastest message board... ever.
This is a moderated phorum for the CIVILIZED discussion of the Miami Dolphins. In this phorum, there are rules and moderators to make sure you abide by the rules. The moderators for this phorum are JC and Colonel
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Burrow
Posted by: jlyell13 ()
Date: February 15, 2020 06:58AM

With Joe B getting a taste of Miami at the Super Bowl he wants to be here and the phins need to make it happen. His team has never stated they want to play with the Bengals

Offer our first this year and next and maybe Rosen, or a pick received for Rosen, for him.
A win win for all

Phins get the guy they want and have an abundance of trade value
Burrow goes where he wants
Bengals get 2 firsts , can take Simmons , Herbert Tua or whomever
they want at 5, could sign Mariota Tannehill, Bridgewater Newton.

My projection, The phins will make a substantial offer that Cincy can't refuse

If the Phins land Fowler or Ngakoue or a top OL Conklin, Scherff in FA , or a Melvin Gordon, Austin Ekeler or Kateem Hunt would increase the potential of the Steeler or Texan pick being included

Phins could still land 4 of the following in the first 2 rounds

Burrow
Dobbins or Swift
Epenesa Gross Matos or Anae
Josh Jones Tyler Biadasz, Shame Lemieux, Austin Jackson
Cam Dantzler Jeff Gladney or Grant Delpit


Phins will win 10 games next season and have rebuilt like the niners



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 02/15/2020 07:03AM by jlyell13.

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Re: Burrow
Date: February 16, 2020 12:17PM

Burrows would be the only QB in a while worthy of moving up for.

I'd still be against it if we didnt have 5 first rounders in the next 2 yrs. Packaging 2 for 1 for a player like Burrows would be a no brainer in my book.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: captkoi ()
Date: February 16, 2020 12:52PM

TreasurecoastPhinsfan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Burrows would be the only QB in a while worthy of
> moving up for.
>
> I'd still be against it if we didnt have 5 first
> rounders in the next 2 yrs. Packaging 2 for 1 for
> a player like Burrows would be a no brainer in my
> book.

************************************************

The problem with that, TC, is that we would lose one of the two first rounders for next year's draft (and probably one this year), along with maybe another two picks this year.

As has been said on many occasions on this board, it won't matter who we get at QB if we don't shore up that OL. FA will produce at least one starter, along with maybe two more in the draft. Hopefully, of the guys who are presently on the roster, they will improve over how they played last season.

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: ChyrenB ()
Date: February 16, 2020 03:27PM

We draft what? Fifth? No need to move UP. We will probably be able to get Fromm or Herbert if not Burrow at 5.

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: jlyell13 ()
Date: February 16, 2020 04:51PM

ChyrenB if after the combine we rate Herbert , Tua, Fromm or Love close to Joe B we wouldn't move up, but if not 5, Steelers or Texans and next years #1 worth it

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Re: Burrow
Date: February 16, 2020 05:01PM

None of those QBs are close to Burrows.
He is elite. The others are good prospects.

He will be #1 in the draft. If we cab move up and only lose 1 #1 pick next year.....#5 and our 1st this year ....we do it.

But I dont believe we get off that cheap. I'd like to know exactly what it would cost to move up 4 spots. Burrows is a stud.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: mizzou15 ()
Date: February 17, 2020 07:43AM

Cincy will want the kitchen sink for Burrows and justifiably so. We will probably have to trade up to get Herbert. Im thinking someone will trade above us to get him. Im holding on to my original thinking of staying at 5 and grabbing Herbert. If he is not there get Hurst, Eason of From later in the first or with our first number 2.

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: samsam3738 ()
Date: February 17, 2020 09:22AM

Herbert will fall to 5. No need to trade up.

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Re: Burrow
Date: February 17, 2020 02:36PM

mizzou15 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cincy will want the kitchen sink for Burrows and
> justifiably so. We will probably have to trade up
> to get Herbert. Im thinking someone will trade
> above us to get him. Im holding on to my original
> thinking of staying at 5 and grabbing Herbert. If
> he is not there get Hurst, Eason of From later in
> the first or with our first number 2.

I agree. But the only QB worth trading up for is Burrows. No way we get off that cheap. Taking a QB at #5 is up to the Dolphins. We dont Have to have it to be successful next season. We can always sure up the trenches so when we do get a young stud he will be successful.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: jsm08 ()
Date: February 18, 2020 01:25AM

If tua checks out medically he's the only QB worthy of the 5th pick aside from burrow but is a big risk.

There is nothing about herbert's game that jumps out at you. He's another tannehill type that needs everything around him to be working for him to succeed.

We have too many needs to reach for a QB at 5 when he'll be available at 18 or 26.

The giants could have had josh allen at 6 and still got jones at 17 last year. We don't need to make that same mistake.

In fact, imo, if we draft Herbert at 5 Rosen will beat him out.

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: astro34 ()
Date: February 18, 2020 08:48AM

Burrow is basically a one year wonder in the college ranks, we could have drafted him in the 5th round at the start of the year. Herbert has done it for a few years in Oregon. Didn't have a great senior year but has a cannon arm.... remind you of anyone? Burrow could be anything from great to this years Trubisky. I would be ok with drafting Herbert #5, better that wasting picks and trading up for Tua. Heck I would even be OK with taking Fromm, Love , Hurts with a later first rounder or even Gordon in the second. Lots of options, and lots of other holes to fill.

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: samsam3738 ()
Date: February 18, 2020 09:49AM

NO TUA

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: astro34 ()
Date: February 18, 2020 10:14AM

I keep reading Burrow has leverage on trying not to go to the Bengals. I am not understanding the leverage.

Elway forced a trade but was going to play baseball if he was not picked by who he wanted. Russell Wilson got drafted later than he should have because of the same rumor about baseball. Eli Manning basically forced a trade by threatening to sit out a year, and his QB dad had a hand in it. That is really the only situation I can think about because of someone not wanting to play somewhere else.

So what leverage does he have besides saying I don't want to play in Cincinnati?

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: ChyrenB ()
Date: February 18, 2020 10:19AM

First let me make it clear. We draft at number five.

Under no circumstances would I deal to draft at number 4, 3, 2 or 1.

However, I would not pass on Burrows, Fromm, OR Hurts at 5.

I WOULD pass on Tua because I think the health risk has not been settled.

Finally, I would not draft ANYTHING BUT a quarterback at number 5.

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Re: Burrow
Date: February 18, 2020 11:47AM

jsm08 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> There is nothing about herbert's game that jumps
> out at you. He's another tannehill type that
> needs everything around him to be working for him
> to succeed.
>



That's kind of a silly thing to say.
What QB doesnt need everything around him to be working to be successful?
You think Patrick Mahomes would have won without blocking , a running game , and a good defense? Any QB we get . .Burrows to Tua to Fitz. Needs great players around him. It's why Marino the best ever ultimately failed.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: jsm08 ()
Date: February 18, 2020 12:12PM

Aaron Rogers, Pat Mahomes, Drew Brees, Russell Wilson, Deshaun Watson.

We spent 7 years trying to build a team around Tannehill. I don't want to see the team do the exact same thing with Herbert.

And Chryen, Hurts is projected to go in the 3rd or 4th round, Fromm 2nd or 3rd. Reaching for them at 5 would be a colossal mistake.

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: jsm08 ()
Date: February 18, 2020 12:14PM

And Treasure, I don't want to get into some thread killing debate about Tannehill. It was just a comparison.

He's no longer on the team and is pointless to keep talking about him.

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Re: Burrow
Date: February 18, 2020 01:10PM

jsm08 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And Treasure, I don't want to get into some thread
> killing debate about Tannehill. It was just a
> comparison.
>
> He's no longer on the team and is pointless to
> keep talking about him.

First off.. You brought it up.
I just pointed out it was a dumb comparison. Dont pee on the floor and then complain its wet.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: Burrow
Date: February 18, 2020 01:12PM

Maybe the leverage we are looking for:

"Joe Burrow mentions draft ‘leverage;’ calls for him to elude Bengals increase"

Might do an Eli Manning and want a trade.....Miami has the most trade capital.eye rolling smileydrinking smiley

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: samsam3738 ()
Date: February 18, 2020 01:46PM

Im so glad we got rid of the wet firecracker tannehill. Tennesee will get tired of him as well you'll see.

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Re: Burrow
Date: February 18, 2020 03:43PM

samsam3738 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Im so glad we got rid of the wet firecracker
> tannehill. Tennesee will get tired of him as well
> you'll see.


I'm so glad he won comeback player of the year , started in the Probowl. It obviously bothers you that you were soooooo wrong about him . I'm vindicated 100%. I won. Its over but as long as ya'all want to keep bringing it up I'm game. grinning smileydrinking smiley

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: ChyrenB ()
Date: February 18, 2020 05:45PM

Please explain to me the difference between Tannehill not being right, ON ONE HAND, and Tannehill not being right FOR Miami on the other hand?????

Miami is the only team we are rooting for.

Yes, he looks a lot better now that he's in Tennessee.

But what good does that do us????? He's not here in Miami and we are Dolfans, not Tifans (my word).

I tried to get you to see for years that we were using him in the wrong offensive scheme. I've watched him play in Tennessee and they put him in the same type of offensive scheme he played in high school and at Texas A & M. But you were so stupidly loyal to Tannehill that you didn't take my point and join in with me.

Maybe you were being loyal to Ross and the Miami Dolphin ownership..... I dunno. Maybe you just didn't know the difference between a traditional pro set and a read option offense.

Well the read option has been in high school and college in recent years and found its way into the NFL with Cam Newton and other teams like San Francisco and Colin Kaepernick.

It calls on the center to shift the ball through his legs to the Quarterback or one of the other backs who are all about three yards behind the line of scrimmage and the QB will then hand off, lateral, or quick pass the ball. He does NOT stand in the pocket.

When Tannehill came here, probably for the first time since he was in Junior High School, he was forced in the pocket.

He was confused to the point of being immobile with indecision.

Can't you see that?

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: jlyell13 ()
Date: February 18, 2020 05:46PM

astro34 Tom Brady wasn't even a one year wonder! Any good scout can see what he brings

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Re: Burrow
Date: February 18, 2020 07:58PM

ChyrenB
>
> Can't you see that?

I see a QB sam said was destined to " ride the Pine boy". To be nothing but a clipboard holder for the rest of his career.

Instead he was the best rated QB in the NFL. Won comeback player of the year. Started in the Probowl after taking his team to the AFC championship. THOSE ARE FACTS.

I won. I WAS RIGHT. And it kills you becuase you know I'll probably be right about picking the next QB. You dont have a clue who you even want. Just a QB at #5 period. That's all. No facts, nothing. Just want what you want like a child in A store pointing at a toy. You want it. But you cant cant say why. Lol.

And remember.....I didnt bring it up. drinking smiley

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: ChyrenB ()
Date: February 18, 2020 09:31PM

LOL. You're off the rails.

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: astro34 ()
Date: February 19, 2020 02:41AM

Can we move on from Tannehill!!!!!!!!!!!!! Holy crap! We traded him, he is gone, he was not good here for the most part and won games in tennessee because of a great running back. BLAH BLAH BLAH

Now onto today. I said Burrow was a one season wonder. He is, hell I got on the field more than he did for his first college and I am an athletic trainer. He first year at LSU was average then he went nuts. Tannehill did the same thing and so did Trubisky (and Brady's numbers were nothing to write home about at Michigan that's why he went in the sixth round). I am not saying that Burrow will be crap, I like his game. Just not sure if we should give up so much to trade to get him even if he does not want to play in Cincinnati.

FYI(Rivers for Manning trade involved A 1st and third rounder one year and a 1st and fifth the next year, San Diego actually did better in that trade for the first three years, NY eventually looks like they won the trade because they won two super bowls, but that was mainly because of the Defensive line they put together) Although #5 this year and Houston's first rounder next year may bget it done.

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: jsm08 ()
Date: February 19, 2020 04:27AM

At what point do you take a chance on a QB? What Burrow just did was nothing short of amazing. Because he got injured while competing against a 5th year senior in Barrett or Dwayne Haskins doesn't make him a bad QB.

At some point you have to show some conviction for a guy that you think will be a generational type player.

If the approach is to make excuses until the next Andrew Luck or Peyton Manning appear then build your roster in the first and 2nd and take a QB in the 3rd. If it doesn't work out you have Lawrence and Fields to go after next year unless, of course, there's no knock on them.

And as to the comparison to the other QBs they won nothing in college. Burrow won the National Championship after going undefeated in the best conference in the country. He grew as a player from his first to second year at LSU. Herberts been the same QB all four years with the same problems he had his freshman year.

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: astro34 ()
Date: February 19, 2020 05:11AM

I am all for taking a QB at #5 or some other time. Pick a guy and go with it. If Burrow fell to us at 5 then I would jump at him. If it cost us three first rounders then I think someone like (Herbert, Fromm, Love , Hurts) with the other player would make us a better team.

Burrow is just like Tua: his team was loaded. Possibly 3 to 4 defensive players can be taken in the first round. A great receiver and running back(who I like a lot). That is not a knock on LSU or the SEC, I loved watching that team. Just facts. Hebert's receivers were bad, Fromm's Georgia team had a bad game against South Carolina. Love played in a bad conference. Hurts had similar numbers to the Oklahoma QB's taken first in the draft, yet no love for him.

I guess it all comes down to I really believe that a good QB will look great with 10 great players around him on offense. but a great QB will not be great with 10 average players on the field with him. So no matter how good the QB is he needs help.

Could any of the QB"S be "generational players" .....maybe.

I do love Burrow.... but think Herbert could be special as well.

FYI .... the only "generational players" is see right now in this draft are Young and Simmons



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/19/2020 05:12AM by astro34.

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Re: Burrow
Posted by: jsm08 ()
Date: February 19, 2020 06:59AM

I've seen nothing in Herbert's game that says special. Not saying he can't be a good qb, just don't think he's worth the 5th pick.

IMO the only QBs worth a top 5 pick are Burrow and Tua but his injuries make it risky.

If they're not there then take Simmons at 5 and get a QB later.

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Re: Burrow
Date: February 19, 2020 08:13AM

I'm all about moving on. But we need to put ANY QB we get in a position to succeed. What we did to Tannehill was criminal. I believe Flores is much smarter and will build up the trenches , the defense so we can move on.

If we didnt have 3 #1's I'd say we have no buisness picking a QB anywhere. But we can afford it , just dont spend for the sake of spending as others have said here. You dont just keep wasting 1st round capital. Pick a QB if you have done your Homework and believe in him. This is a huge draft for us. They pick a QB at #5 I expect him to be around for at least a decade.

GO DOLPHINS!!!!

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