He gets a do-over IMO for finally finding his sack and drafting a QB in the 1st round.

I noticed he didn't mess around too much in FA...where he hasn't exactly been successful. No big acquisitions this year.

He has basically only had two drafts to date.

2012
Ryan Tannehill QB Texas A&M
Jonathan Martin T Stanford
Olivier Vernon DE Miami (FL)
Michael Egnew TE Missouri
Lamar Miller RB Miami (FL)
Josh Kaddu LB Oregon
B.J. Cunningham WR Michigan State
Kheeston Randall DT Texas
Rishard Matthews WR Nevada

2011
Mike Pouncey G Florida
Daniel Thomas RB Kansas State
Edmond Gates WR Abilene Christian
Charles Clay TE
Frank Kearse DT Alabama A&M
Jimmy Wilson

Not too bad but too early to judge. he bought himself at least two more years with the drafting of RT.

I give him a big F for the Marco Columbo addition last year. There were much better options available. MC sucked before he got here and was terrible last year. JI should have known what a blind man could see.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/17/2012 09:11AM by eesti.

eesti Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> He gets a do-over IMO for finally finding his sack
> and drafting a QB in the 1st round.
>
> I noticed he didn't mess around too much in
> FA...where he hasn't exactly been successful. No
> big acquisitions this year.
>
> He has basically only had two drafts to date.
>
> 2012
> Ryan Tannehill QB Texas A&M
> Jonathan Martin T Stanford
> Olivier Vernon DE Miami (FL)
> Michael Egnew TE Missouri
> Lamar Miller RB Miami (FL)
> Josh Kaddu LB Oregon
> B.J. Cunningham WR Michigan State
> Kheeston Randall DT Texas
> Rishard Matthews WR Nevada
>
> 2011
> Mike Pouncey G Florida
> Daniel Thomas RB Kansas State
> Edmond Gates WR Abilene Christian
> Charles Clay TE
> Frank Kearse DT Alabama A&M
> Jimmy Wilson
>
> Not too bad but too early to judge. he bought
> himself at least two more years with the drafting
> of RT.

I don't know how much of our bargain shopping approach this year was Ireland's philosophy, a change in that philosophy, or just the fact that we didn't have much room to overspend cap-wise.

There’s no reason why Ireland cannot be one of the best young GM’s in the league. He has the connections, a great staff, lots of budget, and a respected eye for talent. He seems to be learning from his mistakes and is ramping up on the experience side.

I think he’s being less formulistic than in the past, and beyond that, using a different “spec” than the prototypical Parcells (aka Project BIG). Though Ireland is still married to basic criteria like ideal size, wing span and such. In the latter rounds he seems to be willing to bend those rules if he can find a player. Of course that’s precisely the way you have to weight the draft relative to what round you’re taking a guy and what you’re willing to sacrifice in terms of some theoretical ideal.

Ireland should only get BETTER at his job for another 2-3 years. After that, he’ll be at his zenith and maybe we get a solid 10-15 out of his punk ass.

BNF.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/17/2012 09:30AM by BigNastyFish.

Pretty quiet on this front, as both media and scorned fans got what they wanted with Ireland drafting Tannehill.

Ireland did a good job, in keeping his cards to the vest and IMHO in his selections.

Too early to tell for now, but I think its going to be a much more exciting team to watch and a better offense.


The issue is that so too did the competition in the division get better.

Hoping the coaching change and the draft lifts this team into a winning spree - Lord knows we need one!

eesti Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> He gets a do-over IMO for finally finding his sack
> and drafting a QB in the 1st round.

Agree w/ everything except the "finding his sack" part, in regards to drafting a QB in the 1st round.

There's a big difference between finding sack and being smart.

In last years draft, there wasn't a QB worth taking at our spot in the draft that trumped our need for TBPA at a position of need.
Pouncey was a much better pick than whoever QB was still available.
The chance to get a potential pro bowl C for the next 8-10 years was too good to pass up, and I totally agree.

I will let the teams record speak for its self

eesti Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> I give him a big F for the Marco Columbo addition
> last year. There were much better options
> available.

I could be wrong, but I'm taking a guess that Sparano influenced JI to pick up Columbo. JI probably trusted Sparano's call on it being that he was a former OL coach and thought highly of him. I remember hearing Sparano say during a presser I watched after a game that "Columbo did a good job" when even a 2 year old could see plain as day that the guy absolutely sucked.

I bet that JI is well aware by now that the Miami fan base has had enough of the Dallas homer-ism. Now that Joe Philbin is here, it'll be interesting to see how much of a better influence he'll be as a head coach. I'm pretty anxious to see what he can do to improve this Dolphins team.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/17/2012 10:23PM by 808phan.

eesti Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I could be wrong, but I'm taking a guess that
> Sparano influenced JI to pick up Columbo. JI
> probably trusted Sparano's call on it being that
> he was a former OL coach and thought highly of
> him. I remember hearing Sparano say during a
> presser I watched after a game that "Columbo did a
> good job" when even a 2 year old could see plain
> as day that the guy absolutely sucked.
>
> Sporano wasn't the type of guy to throw Ireland
> undre the bus. What else coul dhe say about
> Columbo? He was already stuck with him.
>
> Ireland is the personnel guy. He is supposed to be
> the expert at finding the right players for the
> system. It falls on him, no excuses. There were a
> dozen other FA O-lineman better than Columbo in
> 2011.


I think the blame for the Columbo signing is evenly split between Sparano and Ireland.

I'm sure Sparano wanted him based on their past successes/relationship working together. I think this is evidenced by the fact that Sparano stuck with him despite his atrocious play.

Its Ireland's job to bring in guys that will be effective in whatever system we are running. I'm sure Sparano endorsed the move, but its Ireland's job to temper the need for a player versus the talent left in the tank.

He blew it on that one. But that's going to happen a lot with cheap re-treads.

The worst part about that move was they kept him around all season when it was pretty clear right away he was done and there were better options on our roster and on the street.

dolphaholic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> eesti Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Parcels, the "genius" did pass on some premier
> > talent while trying to stick to his
> trenches/big
> > men first mentality and let his ego dictate
> that
> > we pass on skill positions.
> >
> > 2008
> > Joe Flacco> Merling over Calais Campbell
> > Matt Flynn was drafted same year as Henne but
> in
> > the 7th round
>
>
> Not real sure how you can say he passed on Flacco?
> We weren't taking him #1 overall, and he wasn't
> there for us in the 2nd.


That's part of why Ireland deserves a lot of credit for how he got Tannehill. Tannehill will either prove to be a good pick or not over the next few years, but Ireland deserves credit for reading the market correctly and not panicking and moving up to get his guy or staying put and getting jumped.

With Flacco, Parcells thought we'd get him at 32. He was wrong and had to settle for Henne, who he didn't think enough of to take at #32.

dolphaholic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> eesti Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Parcels, the "genius" did pass on some premier
> > talent while trying to stick to his
> trenches/big
> > men first mentality and let his ego dictate
> that
> > we pass on skill positions.
> >
> > 2008
> > Joe Flacco> Merling over Calais Campbell
> > Matt Flynn was drafted same year as Henne but
> in
> > the 7th round
>
>
> Not real sure how you can say he passed on Flacco?
> We weren't taking him #1 overall, and he wasn't
> there for us in the 2nd.

By growing some balls and trading up 14 spots from 32 where all we got was a backup player in Merling....yet another Clemson DE flop.

.....................................................................................
“I'm here" You're welcome!" - Kenny Powers



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/18/2012 09:41AM by eesti.

I love how all of the bad things the GM has done get blamed on Parcells, and Sparano... And everything else good was all him...lol... very ironic.... but it never ceases to amaze that it is the case and argument many people around here regularly make.. It is laughable at best....
The GM hires personel, the coach, coaches the personel, the GM hires.... end of story.. You cant pick and choose the moves the GM has made, and blame the bad moves, on coaches who' s job has nothing to do with hiring personel... And all of the prior personel moves were enitrely on the vice president, the GM really didnt do anything for 2 years... It was all fake... It was all somebody else..lol

-----------------------------------------------------------------
All things are subject to interpretation whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth.
Nietzsche

Crowder: I love how all of the bad things the GM has done get blamed on Parcells, and Sparano... And everything else good was all him...lol... very ironic.... but it never ceases to amaze that it is the case and argument many people around here regularly make.. It is laughable at best....
The GM hires personel, the coach, coaches the personel, the GM hires.... end of story.. You cant pick and choose the moves the GM has made, and blame the bad moves, on coaches who' s job has nothing to do with hiring personel... And all of the prior personel moves were enitrely on the vice president, the GM really didnt do anything for 2 years... It was all fake... It was all somebody else..lol

*****
I'm going to respectfully say that I feel like you may be missing an important piece of coordination in this rather simplistic separation of roles.

Yes its is true that the primary roles break out to GM is primary for talent selection, and the coaches coach BUT:

1. The relationship and intellect to pick players that make the coach'system flourish is where they overlap and synergy is critical ... versus just the highest rated selection etc.

2. Cases in point ... Scrambling QB, intelligent, able to deal with on field decisions and changes as needed with a WCO.

- Getting rid of a diva all about me WR, for draft picks and picking up a quality TE with an extra 3rd, that also plays into Philbin's WCO use of a pass it around strategy and pass catching WRs & TEs
- Firming up the right side of the linefor a more pass happy offense
- Hiring a offensive coordinator that compliments Philbin's offensive style
- etc etdc you get my point, other examples

3. Bottom line the separation of GM and Coach is grossly overstated, as they have mutual dependencies.

4. I think this relationship between Philbin & Ireland has much greater potential than the last one. Sparano played out an old and tire Parcels script.

- Thus the team talent roster stagnated, and we didn't see a lot of player talent improvement once they got on the roster.

- Ireland is on the same page with Philbin and has radically changed his focus to support the player / coach talent because he understands that he needs to supply the talent that the coach needs for them both to be successful!

Win-win IMHO. It's about time we got a coach who can relate with the GM to bring in the right talent. It's not an accident and both share the credit & blame for the results.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/18/2012 11:55AM by Phinjim.

Let's me just say, I am so glad we did t draft Joe Flacco, who in my opinion, is only a notch better than Chad Henne.

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"

So Parcells was GM for 1 year - it was the year we were 11-5.

For tow years om a row, Ireland has us at 6-10.

Ireland has been a buffoon. 6 months ago, everyone knew that. Heck, people were hire planes the pull "Fire Ireland" signs, and picketing the stadium to fire the guy. And nobody except our spineless owner defended him. Nobody.

Somehow with the Tannehill pick, everyone forgot that Ireland sucked. I'm sure the GM is laughing about that one. Particularly since it will take until 2012 season before we see Tannehill play and can judge the pick.

Sorry guys I just don't think the guy with the title of GM, should have any excuses for accountability on personel moves... A GM's primary jobs is grading and acquiring personel. So any moves that were made while he was GM for better or worse he had a role in... What happen to accountability..... You
know "where the buck stops"... I am not a fan of blurring the lines of accountability, to cast blame or success on others. The key to success of any organization starts with accountability. Ireland was at least the number 2 guy in charge of personel and scouts for almost 5 years.. When parcells was gone and he was undoubtedly the #1 guy, you guys justify blaming the coach for the Columbo personel move... Does it ever end... If he misses on Tannehill, will it be Sherman's fault... Lol

-----------------------------------------------------------------
All things are subject to interpretation whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth.
Nietzsche

I don't know how anyone can say Ireland was "the guy" while Parcells was in Miami. Parcells made all the decisions. Case in point: Ireland didn't want Pat White, Miami drafted him in the 2nd round. Who's call do you think that was?

Also, you will never hear Ireland saying that he wasn't making the decisions (while Parcells was around). He is above that.

Ireland should be judged based solely on the drafts where Parcells was no longer looking over his shoulder.

Ireland was the GM... What do you think he did while he was t\here, for the first 3 drafts you deny his involvement or impact. You think Parcells sat around looking for players nonstop till 4 in the morning, running scouts, putting it all together, while Ireland ate peanuts... Ireland and Parcells at the very least did it together... Parcells trusted and hired Ireland to be the GM but you think he had no impact... In fact, Ireland probably had more input then Parcells in those drafts, he is the young buck trying to show his skills, while Parcells, oversaw, the operation... It wasnt Ireland playing solitaire for 3 years, while Parcells at his age, ran around like a 45 year old GM. Parcells oversaw the operation, Ireland was the GM... Sure Parcells, maybe pushed for a couple picks, but no more then I am sure Ireland pushed for picks, as the GM.. To give Ireland zero accountability, for his first 3 drafts as a GM, is beyound ridiculous...

-----------------------------------------------------------------
All things are subject to interpretation whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth.
Nietzsche



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/21/2012 10:25AM by Crowder52.

When you clean the bathroom, you don't say, "Well, maybe we can leave this one stain."

I am not for firing Ireland unless you have a legitimate guy that can do better then him.. I surely dont like how he has handled some situtaions, but maybe he will have learned from them.. Being a GM is a tough job. I surely dont want Randy Mueller back..lol.. I hope Ireland does better, and has nailed the last 2 drafts, maybe he has maybe he hasnt... But I also dont think he should avoid any accountability on what went down or goes down while he was GM. Columbo, was just to much, when people started placing blame on Sparano for signing Columbo... It seems like they are looking for reason to deflect blame and accountability away from the guy no matter what.... kind of ridiculous.. If Ireland nailed it on Tannehill and 3 years from now we are consistent play off team becasue of him, I will be the first guy to give Ireland a ton of credit, and not look to give Sherman or Ross the credit for a personel move.

-----------------------------------------------------------------
All things are subject to interpretation whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth.
Nietzsche

Charlie Casserly said that Parcells told him the year before we drafted Pat White, that he (parcells) was infatuated with White. He told Casserly that no matter what, he was going to draft Pat White.

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"

Crowder52 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ireland was the GM... What do you think he did
> while he was t\here, for the first 3 drafts you
> deny his involvement or impact. You think
> Parcells sat around looking for players nonstop
> till 4 in the morning, running scouts, putting it
> all together, while Ireland ate peanuts... Ireland
> and Parcells at the very least did it together...
> Parcells trusted and hired Ireland to be the GM
> but you think he had no impact... In fact, Ireland
> probably had more input then Parcells in those
> drafts, he is the young buck trying to show his
> skills, while Parcells, oversaw, the operation...
> It wasnt Ireland playing solitaire for 3 years,
> while Parcells at his age, ran around like a 45
> year old GM. Parcells oversaw the operation,
> Ireland was the GM... Sure Parcells, maybe pushed
> for a couple picks, but no more then I am sure
> Ireland pushed for picks, as the GM.. To give
> Ireland zero accountability, for his first 3
> drafts as a GM, is beyound ridiculous...

Nobody is saying that Ireland wasn't involved in the process...of course he was...parcells was grooming him. But parcells had the final say on players both drafted and free agent. Ireland did the legwork.

The point you are missing Mr. MM is that there simply is no way to KNOW which picks were parcells and which were Ireland's. Frankly its ridiculous to judge someone on things you presume were their successes/mistakes without knowing for sure that he was responsible.

I for one will judge Ireland for what I KNOW we're his decisions, That starts with last two off seasons but it doesn't end there. I'm willing to factor in reports from sources that might have knowledge of a situation. For example, it's been widely reported that parcells wanted pat white and ireland didn't. So Ireland's gets points for that.

But it seems from your posts that Ireland has as much if not more culpability than parcells in those first 3 years. Perhaps you can post a list of what picks are each of their responsibilities along with a brief explanation of how you know this so we can properly assess our GM's performance?

Crowder52 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> If Ireland nailed it
> on Tannehill and 3 years from now we are
> consistent play off team becasue of him, I will be
> the first guy to give Ireland a ton of credit,

Actually, at that point you'd probably be THE LAST guy to give him credit...but hey,...first...last...what's the difference?



> and not look to give Sherman or Ross the credit
> for a personel move.

Seriously? Talk about ridiculous...


Conflating the input into the decision making process of an offensive co-ordinator and an owner, neither of whom has final say over personnel, with that of a vice president of football operations who had TOTAL control and final say over EVERY personnel move seems insanely absurd, even for you.

A&O, pat white was one player drafted... How about all of the other guys that didn't work out.. You think all those moves are on Parcells and not Ireland.

-----------------------------------------------------------------
All things are subject to interpretation whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth.
Nietzsche

I never said anything about those other players.

I was just telling a story about what Charlie Casserly said on NFL Network one day.

---------------------

"When you suck long enough, you get a Hickey"